Faceting and Cabbing machine choice

No big news that i'm into gems having divided my time between gold prospecting and gem prospecting. It has come to a point that the relaxation and powerful satisfaction levels of gem faceting and cabbing has intrigued me to a point where im really into gems as a hobby to a point where im watching videos of faceting and cabbing. While im only at the point of joining a lapidary club, id love to know any recommendations on machines.

Ive just watched the Ultratec vids and so far impressed, any comments on machines that are good to go for the next 20 years? Love the digital dial but looks super expensive.

Not sure yet but I want to start with the best or comparable to the best if i'm going to start cutting for the rest of my life and not being one to keep buying different machines.

Currently into either cabbing or prob more faceting......what should I be looking at even if its only second hand? Or is second hand a non go on these purchases? I certainly dont like buying one thing and then in 1 year realsising I bought the beginners version and now I have to upgrade!

Help Needed!

My recent adventure pics: https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=9739

Twapster

Dude, if you can afford the UltraTec that's a no-brainer for repeatability, acurracy, lifespan and customer service. These guys are hardcore machinists and really do a LOT more than faceting machines (it's a tiny fraction of their business) but then they really do them great. ALthough I'm a huge proponent of their stuff (and will get myself one when money permits) my best advice would be to find a lapidary club that has different machines, try them all, and find your fave.

Cabbing is a really different matter. You can cab stuff with something as cheap and versatile as a Dremel (what I've been doing for like ten years myself). Fine diamond wheels for the Dremel can be found for very decent prices on ebay to do the roughing, but after that you might need to play around with wet sandpaper over rubber mandrels. You can really do decent cabs that way but if you want to start the easy way and have some money, then get a cabbing machine. Two wheels minimum, one for coarse grit, one for finer, and a buffing wheel on the side for final polishing. I'd go four wheels if I had to buy one though, less time spent on the fine wheel means faster cabbing time and way less wear on the belts. My two cents. Now to take a picture of that emmy in the matrix that I cabbed six years ago...

lol tks Thomas, u have enlightened me!

I cut cabs only on a faceting machine and although I think the ultratec is a great machine and probably the most accurate on the markets I don't like the motoring system. I sold barney a twenty year old ultratec and its quieter than his brand new one. Id go a gemmasta GF4. second hand gemmastas on gumtree regualry and they sell pretty quick. They tune up like new and if new motoring are needed its still heaps cheaper than brand new. it doesn't cost too much to setup a cabbing system on a faceting machine.Im in Sydney if t hat's a help.

Ok then no cabbing machine required? Any other equipment a must? ie cutting gems?

One of my painstakingly cut cabs with the Dremel. Tough stuff though, it's a columbian emerald in the matrix. Not the gemmiest of them all but I like the pattern. 12 cts finished, still needs a thinner polish though.



But I can tell ya, the satisfaction you get from turning a rough stone into something civilized is really not overrated!

Thats for sure, i can sit there all night scrolling thru my rough stones, the added ability to transform them must be very satisfying!

G'day Twapster,

there is currently a 2nd hand Gemmasta on Gumtree at the moment

http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/salisbury-east/miscellaneous-goods/facetting-machine/1066180875

The owner is an experienced facetor and AFLACA judge who has had a number of his designs used for National and International competitions, he is a very meticulous cutter and is fastidious with his machinery - The machine might be worth a look.

I've just ordered another Gemmasta for one of the Clubs I belong to. They are a proven machine and as the club has several other Gemmasta's and the quills are interchangeable are ideal for club use. (also they are made here in S.A. so servicing is easy for us.) Don't dismiss other Australian machines including the VJ (also it has a digital protractor) and the Unamit machine designed by Laurie Hall.

My recommendation before buying a machine is to join a gemclub to learn faceting then look for a machine.

Cheers

Tks Dughug, exactly my plan. Just want to do the research on machines while im getting into it. Seen the ones on Gumtree but will hold off until ive joined the club and am certain I want to continue with cutting. Since im mostly home in the evenings I sometimes get bored and would love to be able to sit there at night and carve out some of the stones ive brought back from my trips instead of just surfing the net and watching foxtel!

Any other equipment a must?

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http://www.facetingbook.com/

These books will answer many questions you have. The pro's and con's of what you use. Dopping for example - dopping wax, Cyanoacrylate (super glue) or Gorilla glue, epoxy glue's ect, ect, each with pro's and con's. The benefits of each machines attributes - soft stop (light or buzzer or Beale/Woolley) or hard stop?
Do you need a degree splitter or to have a reversible direction lap?
What polishing agents, diamond or oxides? Why? 50,000, 100,000 or 200,000.
The pro's and con's of different laps. pitfalls to avoid, blah, blah, blah.

I've probably raised more questions than answers but these two books of 800 pages for about $70 will fill you in, explain it well and give you more questions to ask with more of an understanding.

I have a Gemmasta GF4 and think it's a great machine. A couple of things I would like improved (a digital degree read out would be nice, but that's not impossible to be added. The info is in the books to). The build is solid, the manufacturer's are local. The removal quill I think is a great benefit many machines don't have.

In my short experience, I've been happy with th Cabking. 6 wheels - #80 and #220 metal bonded grinding wheels and #280, #600, #1200 and #3000 resin bonded wheels plus a #360 flat lap and polishing pads charged with various grits.

I still like to use a soft lap made from a thick rubber-backed outdoor carpet square charged with tin oxide on the little old Hall junior faceting machine for polishing a lot of cabs.

I agree with Mr Magoo the two American books Amateur Gemstone faceting are worth a read even though some of the methods discussed is what was being done in the 60's & 70's and not necessarily reflective of some of the current methods being used. But if it works for you why not?
I received my copies a couple of days after Christmas, took 3 weeks for the mail to get from the land of the Septics and at a cost of around $60.00 which also included a copy of Soukup's book "Facet Cutters Handbook" (written in the 60's) not bad value.

Probably a better book for the beginner is written by a couple of Aussies - Peter Collins & John Broodfoot's "Cutting Gemstones: An introduction to faceting" which is available from John Broodfoot for around $60.00 via Email

[email protected]

As Trapster has already thought about joining a local Gemclub he would probably find suitable faceting books in their library,

Mr Magoo said:

Any other equipment a must?

Click to expand...

http://www.facetingbook.com/

These books will answer many questions you have. The pro's and con's of what you use. Dopping for example - dopping wax, Cyanoacrylate (super glue) or Gorilla glue, epoxy glue's ect, ect, each with pro's and con's. The benefits of each machines attributes - soft stop (light or buzzer or Beale/Woolley) or hard stop?
Do you need a degree splitter or to have a reversible direction lap?
What polishing agents, diamond or oxides? Why? 50,000, 100,000 or 200,000.
The pro's and con's of different laps. pitfalls to avoid, blah, blah, blah.

I've probably raised more questions than answers but these two books of 800 pages for about $70 will fill you in, explain it well and give you more questions to ask with more of an understanding.

I have a Gemmasta GF4 and think it's a great machine. A couple of things I would like improved (a digital degree read out would be nice, but that's not impossible to be added. The info is in the books to). The build is solid, the manufacturer's are local. The removal quill I think is a great benefit many machines don't have.

Click to expand...

Much appreciated, I was actually looking at text books on the net last night so you have read my mind!

Lefty said:

In my short experience, I've been happy with th Cabking. 6 wheels - #80 and #220 metal bonded grinding wheels and #280, #600, #1200 and #3000 resin bonded wheels plus a #360 flat lap and polishing pads charged with various grits.

I still like to use a soft lap made from a thick rubber-backed outdoor carpet square charged with tin oxide on the little old Hall junior faceting machine for polishing a lot of cabs.

Click to expand...

I do like the cabking with the 6 wheels, I guess the question is if I can get by with using a faceting machine to do the cabs as id prob only be cabbing small stuff, would this be overkill? Do you also have some sort of "cutting wheel" as part of the tools?

Not sure what you mean by cutting wheel Twapster. Are you referring to a flat lap? Or did you mean a grooved cabbing lap?

I'm getting a cabbing lap shortly as I too can see myself doing a lot of smaller cabs for jewellery. The bigger cabs are easy on the cabbing machine but little 6 and 7mm cabs get a bit fiddly and Ill have a go at the grooved lap to be put on the little old Hall faceting machine.

Lefty said:

Not sure what you mean by cutting wheel Twapster. Are you referring to a flat lap? Or did you mean a grooved cabbing lap?

I'm getting a cabbing lap shortly as I too can see myself doing a lot of smaller cabs for jewellery. The bigger cabs are easy on the cabbing machine but little 6 and 7mm cabs get a bit fiddly and Ill have a go at the grooved lap to be put on the little old Hall faceting machine.

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Just talking about a machine that will cut slices straight through a rough, lets say I have a sapphire with a crack straight thru the middle but both ends have a cutter in them. What would one use?

I think you meant a circular saw blade for stone Twapster, right? Some faceting machines can accomodate such blades (the UltraTec at least) which is a real rough saver (slice'em instead of dusting'em). But for cabs, indeed you'd better get a diamond circular saw, or build one. Here are a few snappies of my homemade contraption:





Plywood frame, opaque plexiglas for the base (waterproof and slippery when wet, won't rust, perfect for the job).
It's got 31 mm thickness capacity, but the motor (saved from God knows what equipment like twenty years ago) is not beefy enough on low voltage. If you want to build one yourself, think low speed and very high torque. You don't want water and stone dust flying all over you (see my chemistry white coat in my profile pic? it's stained with glorious strands of lapis, ironstone and emerald right now hahaha).
Cost me almost nothing, only the blade and power supply. Timing belt drive as you can see, very stable and easy to align, very few power losses. But then again, I need me a manlier motor on that thing!

Lol very nice, just have to watch that thumb!

Ah, you meant a trim saw Twapster.

Some cabbing machines come with a trim saw on one end, the expanding drum types. I looked at one of those but settled on the bigger unit so it didn't have to keep changing belts all the time. The Cabking can take one on the left hand end I think but I have one anyway, similar to Thomas's. It's actually a wet tile saw and it came with a thick tile cutting blade (diamond edged) and a finer lapidary blade. The the tile blade works great for slicing up small thunder eggs and agate nodules while the finer one is what you would use for cutting up thin slabs or faceting material.

Lol yep, something sharp that saws thru hard stuff.....tks for the info. A trim saw it is!