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#1

LC76
Gone Walkabout
From: Bendigo, VIC
Joined: 20 August 2014
Posts: 971
Gone Walkabout
05 June 2018 10:30 pm

Well this will all but destroy prospecting and 4WD activities around Bendigo.
Not sure what to think as I agree the Indigenous people got a shitty deal in the past and need to get something back,but this kinda pisses me off.
https://www.bendigoadvertiser.com.au/st … lan/?cs=80

The Dja Dja Wurrung Parks Joint Management Plan proposes to restrict uses in 3600 hectares of the Bendigo park, 678 hectares of the Kooyoora State Park and 6426 hectares of the Kara Kara National Park to protect cultural sites and remediate the land.

Areas of three other state parks are also included in the plan.

Uses such as prospecting and four-wheel-driving will be restricted in these areas to ensure significant sites are protected.

#2

LC76
Gone Walkabout
From: Bendigo, VIC
Joined: 20 August 2014
Posts: 971
Gone Walkabout
05 June 2018 10:33 pm

Quote from article  wrote:

Branch president Bill Schulz said they wanted to “work together” with the Dja Dja Wurrung board of management to help manage the land, but believed they had been excluded from the process.

Last edited by LC76 (05 June 2018 10:34 pm)

#3

RM Outback
Member
Joined: 10 March 2016
Posts: 2,548
Member
05 June 2018 11:02 pm

Always a challenge thumbsdown. I respect aboriginal people and their culture but this smells of a green agenda to me. If this gets passed the flood gates are open imo.

1 user likes this post: LC76

#4

Heatho
Moderator
From: Sydney, NSW
Joined: 29 April 2013
Posts: 12,501
Moderator
06 June 2018 09:11 am

I respect them and their culture too but if the government keeps handing everything back to them there will be nothing left for anyone...... Most of the land handbacks have been done very poorly and half probably were probably never the claimants traditional land to start with.

Just my opinion.

I don't think handing back large areas of land is the way to go about it, we are all Australian and should all be able to use such land equally.


Minelab GPX 5000, SDC2300, CTX3030, Equinox 800, patience, lot's of patience.

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#5

xcvator
Member
From: A Wide Brown Land
Joined: 12 September 2016
Posts: 1,126
Member
06 June 2018 10:00 am

Bit strange that by their own admission that most of the old sites and scare trees were destroyed in the gold rush and that they are now going to have to "find" these old sites and restore them


Spending the kids inheritance as fast as I can
Trying to use an XP DEUS

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#6

LC76
Gone Walkabout
From: Bendigo, VIC
Joined: 20 August 2014
Posts: 971
Gone Walkabout
06 June 2018 02:22 pm

I remember reading in I can't remember what book it was, and it was probably extremely biased coming from gold rush reports, that the local indigenous groups only used the Whipstick as a way point on their way to other locations and never actually lived there as it was no good for water and hunting.

I've no doubt there would have been sacred sites or simple but invaluable landmarks used for navigation.
And those sites should be protected if still intact.

But restricting over half the Whipstick and other areas is only going to create a bigger devide and more "us VS them" situations that won't help anyone in long-term.

PMAV should have been included in the discussions and it's a bit of a slap in the face and proof that PMAV just don't have the political teeth to have any affect.

Or am I just a biased prospector and seeing this all wrong?

#7

Teemore
Member
From: Melton West, VIC
Joined: 18 September 2013
Posts: 1,103
Member
06 June 2018 03:02 pm

Not sure where all this is heading ...... and fail to see why they didn't exercise their passion for 'traditional lands' and sacred sites' when local councils/shires carved up public land for sale as small bush 'allotments'.

First it's born-again greenies looking for their piece of bush paradise to set up house and lock us out of and now our indigenous brothers want to lock us out (or allow access under their terms & conditions) of the remainder of the old goldfields.

Victoria is one of the few if only states where prospecting is still half viable and not over restricted or land inaccessible compared to other states so it would naturally be great to keep it that way ..... is the PMAV a toothless tiger ..... I for one can't criticise as I know how difficult it is to run a volunteer organisation with little real interest from the people that it should be benefiting (sadly me included, I pay my m'ship but that's about all). I had stated previously (to the PMAV) that they need to have their name 'out in lights' in the goldfields so that PMAV becomes a known identifier with the areas. Simple signage at the 'entrance' to popular areas reminding us to "fill our holes" or at puddler sites noting them as "protected/digging prohibted" areas would ingrain their name to anyone that passes.

Will the CFA etc now have to seek permission to enter and carry out planned burns ... I'm sure there are many built on bush allotments next to these proposed 'traditional' sites and wonder whether they could become liable, if they restrict CFA access, and a disaster occurs, just as the power companies were.

We live in crazy times of political correctness going overboard, rewriting nursery rhymes, traffic lights with women instead of little green men, gender neutral terms, 'golliwogs' being outlawed etc etc etc.

Rant over ..... will just enjoy what I can at the moment and hope common sense will eventually rule.


If you don't stand for something ..... You'll fall for anything !!
To be old and wise you must first be young and foolish.

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#8

LC76
Gone Walkabout
From: Bendigo, VIC
Joined: 20 August 2014
Posts: 971
Gone Walkabout
06 June 2018 03:29 pm

This is from PMAV facebook 19 May

I have been reading the Draft Joint Management Plan for the Dja Dja Wurrung Parks and I am not happy. This Plan is to replace all existing Park Management Plans for Greater Bendigo National Park, Kooyoora State Park, Kara Kara National Park, Wehla Conservation Reserve and Hepburn Regional Park.
Prospectors lose all round. If this new Management Plan is accepted then we will lose prospecting access to:
another 3,600 hectares (21%) of Bendigo NP,
another 40 hectares (2%) of P...
See more

Why the hell didnt PMAV mention any of this in the forums?
Not everyone is on facebook.

Members of PMAV or not we cant help if we dont know whats going on.

Last edited by LC76 (06 June 2018 03:31 pm)

#9

mbasko
Member
From: Central West NSW
Joined: 27 January 2015
Posts: 3,269
Member
06 June 2018 04:25 pm

It was put on 4umer last month:
http://golddetecting.forumotion.net/t25 … onal-parks
There were public meetings last month & there is a link to an online survey + submissions closing 19th June 2018.
As with most of these type of posts on forums there was a weak reaction with only a handful of people even bothering to respond. Seems most don't care until it's too late unfortunately LC.
Don't know why it wasn't posted on here where there is far more traffic/banter from Victorian fossickers/prospectors?
IMO the Greens will use the Cultural + Heritage angles more & more as there is not enough backbone in their environmental argument. I wouldn't be surprised to see more of it happening Australia wide to be honest. thumbsdown


Everything we use comes from mining or farming.

1 user likes this post: LC76

#10

Ward69
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Joined: 16 May 2018
Posts: 74
Member
06 June 2018 07:55 pm

My two cents worth, Normally. It's about money. someone wants the area for something. Otherwise why do it.

#11

xcvator
Member
From: A Wide Brown Land
Joined: 12 September 2016
Posts: 1,126
Member
06 June 2018 08:14 pm

Ward69 wrote:

My two cents worth, Normally. It's about money. someone wants the area for something. Otherwise why do it.

So the people that have control of it can charge you and me an extra fee to prospect there


Spending the kids inheritance as fast as I can
Trying to use an XP DEUS

1 user likes this post: 7.62marksman

#12

Tathradj
Moderator
From: Tathra, NSW
Joined: 17 February 2014
Posts: 7,246
Moderator
06 June 2018 11:04 pm

Some thing is very wrong here.


A couple of HiBankers inc. accessories, , 4500, SDC2300, Gt1600,
Aldi, Phantom 4 Pro, A Prado 4x4, A'Van Cruiseliner and a heck
of a lot of determination.Not to mention Luck.
Most importantly, A lot of Good Honest Friends.

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#13

LC76
Gone Walkabout
From: Bendigo, VIC
Joined: 20 August 2014
Posts: 971
Gone Walkabout
07 June 2018 01:38 pm

This subjects not getting much of a response.
Is that because not enough people can see it?
Or is it not enough people understand the title?

Or not enough feel like they can do anything about it?
I'm a little confused why this isn't bigger news.

#14

7.62marksman
Member
From: Nowra, NSW
Joined: 26 July 2016
Posts: 5,385
Member
07 June 2018 01:46 pm

I think that is because people don't want to comment because it could be seen as being racial against Indigenous people
and then this thread would go down hill very quick and cause a lot of ill feelings between everybody
Just my thoughts


Highbanker, Sluice, Trommel, Gold Monster 1000 (Khaleesi), Garrett Ace 400i (Rhaegal), Go-Find 40 (Nymeria), Non Turbo 2.8lt Hilux (Turtle), NAPFA member ----A disposal technician at a dead run outranks everybody

1 user likes this post: LC76

#15

HoudiniHarry
Member
From: GT, VIC
Joined: 09 November 2016
Posts: 822
Member
07 June 2018 02:33 pm

7.62marksman wrote:

I think that is because people don't want to comment because it could be seen as being racial against Indigenous people
and then this thread would go down hill very quick and cause a lot of ill feelings between everybody
Just my thoughts

Yes you are spot on..


Having a great time searching for gold....
GPX4500, Equinox 800 and SDC2300

#16

Tathradj
Moderator
From: Tathra, NSW
Joined: 17 February 2014
Posts: 7,246
Moderator
07 June 2018 02:53 pm

Thank You.
Much appreciated. thumbsup thumbsup
.

7.62marksman wrote:

I think that is because people dont want to comment because it could be seen as being ratial against Indigenous people
and then this thread would go down hill very quick and cause a lot of ill feelings between everybody
Just my thoughts


A couple of HiBankers inc. accessories, , 4500, SDC2300, Gt1600,
Aldi, Phantom 4 Pro, A Prado 4x4, A'Van Cruiseliner and a heck
of a lot of determination.Not to mention Luck.
Most importantly, A lot of Good Honest Friends.

#17

nucopia
Member
From: lake mac , NSW
Joined: 07 July 2015
Posts: 2,229
Member
07 June 2018 04:22 pm

The Greens movement are specifically targeting Indigenous groups in Victoria.
1 as a way to push their conservation agenda and
2 to gain support from and ally them selves with Indigenous people and organisations.
They have tried to do this with our local Indigenous land council here, but since the locals are much more orginised and have a lot more control over the lands in the area , very little of which is state or nationals parks etc the Greens really have little to offer in the way of lobbying influence and stratergies to offer the local land council..
The targeting of large tracts of state and Nationals parks in Victoria, is a very cunning way to restict the use of the land by the majority and yet still apear to the general public that the Greenies are championing the cause of the Indegenous. Unfortunatly what the Greens are doing is using one group with in society to usurp the rights of others..
Its a very smart move by them to exploit a minority to restrict the majority and claim they are motivated by a noble cause..
Typical marxist tactic.


every day is an adventure
NAPFA Member

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#18

Way2go
Member
From: Cherrybrook, NSW
Joined: 24 June 2017
Posts: 99
Member
07 June 2018 04:48 pm

My biggest concern would be that the currently open areas are closed off to later be declared as non-used areas that can be developed for housing, business parks etc.
I have seen this happen on a number of occasions and feel that this could be another way for certain government sectors to restrict access so that they can rezone the areas for other uses.

1 user likes this post: LC76

#19

Way2go
Member
From: Cherrybrook, NSW
Joined: 24 June 2017
Posts: 99
Member
07 June 2018 04:54 pm

I forgot to add.

I do support legitimate native title grants and do support aboriginal groups; however, for land grabs etc. I do not support. I would expect to see significant evidence confirming sites of significance. If this cannot be provided, then sorry, it would be considered a land grab. Also most sites are quite small in area and those areas could be appropriately protected without the need to close off the entire area or large portions of the area. Most people I know are also interested in visiting legitimate sites, so as to both pay respect to the sites but also help protect them.

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#20

G0lddigg@
Member
From: Brisbane, QLD
Joined: 03 April 2013
Posts: 4,924
Member
07 June 2018 05:17 pm

i'm not sure how i feel about this one, i've seen indigenous management takeovers have great results and some poor ones. I think the current push is to be the custodians meaning they get to decide what's right for the area from a land management point of view. as with most processes there should be a process of communication with the stakeholders (us, bike riders, 4wders etc) excluding people from the plan is a concern.

If its anything like what happened on the qld nsw border they basically took a strip of land let it grow out of control and it became a dumping ground for cars etc,. flip side ive seen burns that should be done only be done because of indigenous management where the council dont have the balls to do it.

lets hope an amicable outcome is reached. we all know theres damage to our bush and some management is great


*The real Gold is the Journey and the friends we make
Engineering Gold Sluices and Highbankers

1 user likes this post: LC76

#21

Eski
Member
Joined: 10 May 2015
Posts: 120
Member
11 June 2018 02:23 pm

Could this all be a new "option" on the VEAC forrests thingo? Maybe they thought it didn't have legs...

Might be interesting coverage if it all goes ahead.... Imagine a planned protest detecting session with 40+ retirees being locked up in front of the cameras....

#22

Deepseeker
Member
Joined: 13 August 2018
Posts: 12
Member
19 August 2018 06:37 pm

Ok, I know that generally speaking the topic of religion is taboo on this forum, However I think this is important.

Having been chosen recently to witness an amazing revelation, I feel it incumbent upon me to share the below with those who I already believe practice a RELIGION which may actually save our bacon with regard to access to our sacred lands where the holy Leads (both Shallow and Deep) doth dwell.

I found myself sitting bolt upright in bed the other night, with the sweat running down my face. I had just awoken from the most life-like dream I had EVER had in my whole life!

In this dream, which I swear was no dream at all really, rather it was my Astro-travelling self visiting a spirit dwelling abode, I spoke to one of the most powerful gods of all, who required that I address him/her (that’s right they were a dazzling golden human-like form but reproductive organs/ equipment were not apparent and their voice was gender neutral), anyway they said I should address them as “My alluvial Goldness”.

I asked shim (which I think should be the correct pronoun to use here as they are neither him nor her, but perhaps both?) where they came from, and their answer was “ I dwell in the places deemed most alluvial- in soil, rock, river and stream, including the ones which flow no more, both deep and shallow.”

My alluvial Goldness went on to say, “There are some who seek to keep me covered but I need to be found and admired, even having my form changed so that I can adorn both Man and Woman in Holy Ornamentation and to assist technology in reliable performance and conductivity”. I Asked My alluvial Goldness to elaborate, but he, she, it, said “Quiet Humanoid bag of non specific Fluid, this is not some lesson in Fashion or Physics! What I am about to tell thee will assist you in your epic journey of enlightenment as you seek to both uncover and liberate me wherever I exist!”

My Alluvial Goldness explained that there are those who seek to impose their ancient culture and beliefs onto my ancient culture and beliefs, and whereas my culture and beliefs allow ALL to practice theirs while I seek out reefs, nuggets and specs to fuel our ancient economies, and various artistic and cultural forms of expression etc, their beliefs will prevent me from practicing mine, and also prevent Our Alluvial Goldness from attaining the timeless goal of being exposed, retrieved, admired and used.

I shall call this religion “Prospectyrianism”. It has been practiced by Celts, Egyptians, Ancient Greeks, Romans, Incas, Aztecs, Chinese and so, so many other cultures for tens of thousands of years! That’s right, TENS OF THOUSANDS OF YEARS! It truly is one of the oldest practices on earth! Its spirit filled our ancestors at the Eureka stockade with outrage and strength when their right to practice said religion was impinged upon.

Now, One of the most sacred sites where My Alluvial Goldness lives (by the way, residing in multiple places is made possible through the Trinity Miracle known as The Spec, The Nugget, and the Holy Reef. They are all part of the same thing, but I don’t want to confuse people too much for now though, or for that matter make people think that I’m just making stuff up as I go along so that other people can’t do their thing in my holy places). But anyway, one of the holiest of holies for “Prospectyrians” as we are known, is Kooyoora State Park.

This is significant I feel as section 109 of the Australian Constitution states that "If the federal Parliament and a state parliament pass conflicting laws on the same subject, then the federal law overrides the state law, or the part of the state law that is inconsistent with it".

Said Constitution (that many of our forebears fought and died for by the way), also states in Section 116 that the Constitution of Australia precludes the Commonwealth of Australia (i.e., the federal parliament) from making laws for establishing any religion, imposing any religious observance, or prohibiting the free exercise of any religion.

I need to worship in Kooyoora state park! How is my Religion any less important than The Flying Spaghetti Monster, the Jedi Faith or any other religion that is acknowledged under Australian Law?

Clearly, this has become an issue about the freedom to practice our Religion and to worship Our Alluvial Goldness freely!!!, and the law is on our side.

Last edited by Deepseeker (19 August 2018 06:41 pm)


Once I've sold my 1 Million dollar Nugget, I'll spend 1/4 on Sex, 1/4 on Booze, 1/4 on gambling, and the rest I'll just waste....

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