Yep places like Tuena will loose a lot of trade
Action Thread about HighBanking in NSW
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Matt80
Matthew
It was asked if these people are elected or just get the job. Well if it's anything like Qld then they just give the job to someone and expect them to come up with the policies. My sister was working for the Qld government on a multibillion dollar project and was asked to write a key policy that effected a huge amount of the public and a lot of government workers. She had 'some' knowledge of how things worked due to a previous job, but l don't think they knew that when they gave her the task. Instead they handed her piles and piles or policies from over 20 other departments, asked her to come up with a new policy and to sort it out and get it signed off by every other department. Luckily she had the previous experience and knew people that worked in the areas that she was going to be writing the new policy for as the advice and suggestions she was getting from various departments would likely have led to the injury or death of workers, lots of very angry and possibly violent members of the public and a massive outcry by the media.
Simply put, policies tend to be written by people with little or no direct knowledge knowledge of what happens at the ground level or worryingly often public policies are written by lobby groups working for large corporations who happen to be large donators to political parties (lm sure thats just a coincidence). The biggest problem with all of this, other that the stupidity, naivety and possibly shady dealings of it is that a lot of the people making these decisions are next to impossible to remove from their jobs. Firing a public servant is insanely difficult, especially if they can claim they are from a minority group, as such they have no care for their performance or who they upset in the general public.
The only way to get something like this changed at this point is to make things uncomfortable for whoever is responsible for making or changing this policy or to annoy their bosses enough that they get transferred to another department or position. If the person that made this decision isn't consulting well with the relevant groups then it's clear they don't care about those groups, they are likely only focused on the larger scale mining activities, as such being polite and sending letters or emails is unlikely to achieve anything.
The best results for us as prospectors might be to try getting our hobby changed from the department of Mines and primary industries to something more focused on recreational activities along with other similar hobbies. Governments seem to love setting up new departments and it could make for some great press for them. Alternatively have fossicking moved to the tourism portfolio as it might make more sense and get more attention there, indeed the tourism board might be an ally for us given a drop in fossicking equals a drop in tourism.
Simply put, policies tend to be written by people with little or no direct knowledge knowledge of what happens at the ground level or worryingly often public policies are written by lobby groups working for large corporations who happen to be large donators to political parties (lm sure thats just a coincidence). The biggest problem with all of this, other that the stupidity, naivety and possibly shady dealings of it is that a lot of the people making these decisions are next to impossible to remove from their jobs. Firing a public servant is insanely difficult, especially if they can claim they are from a minority group, as such they have no care for their performance or who they upset in the general public.
The only way to get something like this changed at this point is to make things uncomfortable for whoever is responsible for making or changing this policy or to annoy their bosses enough that they get transferred to another department or position. If the person that made this decision isn't consulting well with the relevant groups then it's clear they don't care about those groups, they are likely only focused on the larger scale mining activities, as such being polite and sending letters or emails is unlikely to achieve anything.
The best results for us as prospectors might be to try getting our hobby changed from the department of Mines and primary industries to something more focused on recreational activities along with other similar hobbies. Governments seem to love setting up new departments and it could make for some great press for them. Alternatively have fossicking moved to the tourism portfolio as it might make more sense and get more attention there, indeed the tourism board might be an ally for us given a drop in fossicking equals a drop in tourism.
Small towns like Tuena will almost die unfortunately as will hundreds of similar areas , and not 1 animal , bird or aquatic species will be saved ..
Its pathetic that so called educated professional people can be so wrong .. i hope they are out there in mass numbers holding hands across creeks and rivers trying to divert the destruction mother nature causes with any and every moderate flood , it really is sickening to know these people are suppose to be helping the nation .. i cant think of any words to describe my contempt for these faceless people and i honestly wonder how they sleep at night.
Its pathetic that so called educated professional people can be so wrong .. i hope they are out there in mass numbers holding hands across creeks and rivers trying to divert the destruction mother nature causes with any and every moderate flood , it really is sickening to know these people are suppose to be helping the nation .. i cant think of any words to describe my contempt for these faceless people and i honestly wonder how they sleep at night.
Matt80
Matthew
Sorry about the long post...
So being nice and subservient is unlikely to achieve much unless we had insanely high numbers supporting us(joint protest by multiple groups all dealing with similar rediculous restrictions).
Protesting may work, but you may notice that you need a permit to protest legally (yep there is Australian democracy for u) and if we try to get this changed via protest then it's best to work out where, how, when would be the most effective way to protest. Now we should rule out violence as a matter of course, none of us should want that, but we do have to be careful as a common government tactic around the world is to encite violence from peaceful protests so they have more reason to disperse them. As such if people do protest this then declare suitable leaders ahead of time so everyone knows who is calling the shots and make sure anyone that displays any form of violent behaviour is shunned from the group immediately.
The protest idea is probably the most likely to see change happen, but starting with a media and public display in a region strongly supported by fossicking tourism is a good first move.
If it does move onto protesting though, what would be the best spot? Go to Parliament house, out front of the dpi(just keep a line of cars slowly driving through their carpark at home time so none of them get to go leave), chose a large mine site and disrupt it enough to piss them off so they start putting pressure on the dpi or protest outside of a major morning show or similar media outlet? Plenty of options all with their pros and cons, but at the end of the day, what would put the most pressure on them to change?
So being nice and subservient is unlikely to achieve much unless we had insanely high numbers supporting us(joint protest by multiple groups all dealing with similar rediculous restrictions).
Protesting may work, but you may notice that you need a permit to protest legally (yep there is Australian democracy for u) and if we try to get this changed via protest then it's best to work out where, how, when would be the most effective way to protest. Now we should rule out violence as a matter of course, none of us should want that, but we do have to be careful as a common government tactic around the world is to encite violence from peaceful protests so they have more reason to disperse them. As such if people do protest this then declare suitable leaders ahead of time so everyone knows who is calling the shots and make sure anyone that displays any form of violent behaviour is shunned from the group immediately.
The protest idea is probably the most likely to see change happen, but starting with a media and public display in a region strongly supported by fossicking tourism is a good first move.
If it does move onto protesting though, what would be the best spot? Go to Parliament house, out front of the dpi(just keep a line of cars slowly driving through their carpark at home time so none of them get to go leave), chose a large mine site and disrupt it enough to piss them off so they start putting pressure on the dpi or protest outside of a major morning show or similar media outlet? Plenty of options all with their pros and cons, but at the end of the day, what would put the most pressure on them to change?
Wouldn't surprise me if the NSW Minerals Council is behind this push on fossickers.
They had their noses out of joint about more Fossicking Districts being gazetted in NSW due to their members (mostly large mining companies) losing power to stop us fossicking on EL's in those areas & I made comment on a paper/submission of theirs awhile back which called for more regulatory compliance + enforcement on recreational fossicking activities.
It's a vicious circle unfortunately - them, us & the greens.
A lot of fossickers do us no favours either. Years ago I used to think those doing the wrong thing were the minority - now days I'm not so sure.
Edit:
Heres a recap on what I posted when the 2016 regulation began staged introduction:
https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=19584
They had their noses out of joint about more Fossicking Districts being gazetted in NSW due to their members (mostly large mining companies) losing power to stop us fossicking on EL's in those areas & I made comment on a paper/submission of theirs awhile back which called for more regulatory compliance + enforcement on recreational fossicking activities.
It's a vicious circle unfortunately - them, us & the greens.
A lot of fossickers do us no favours either. Years ago I used to think those doing the wrong thing were the minority - now days I'm not so sure.
Edit:
Heres a recap on what I posted when the 2016 regulation began staged introduction:
https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=19584
Matt80
Matthew
Couldn't agree more Garry,
That's the problem with Qld and indeed most of the country. Most people live in the cities and have no clue about the bush or concept of the size of this country. So many have been brainwashed by media or teachers to think that the environment is a precious thing that will be destroyed by the tiniest action rather than something that deals with massive storms, floods, fires ECT as a matter of course. The environment is not going to care less about a few cubic metres of dirt or gravel being moved, it was going to move it itself sooner or later. I would so love to see the regional areas self manage rather than being dictated to by people with no clue.
That's the problem with Qld and indeed most of the country. Most people live in the cities and have no clue about the bush or concept of the size of this country. So many have been brainwashed by media or teachers to think that the environment is a precious thing that will be destroyed by the tiniest action rather than something that deals with massive storms, floods, fires ECT as a matter of course. The environment is not going to care less about a few cubic metres of dirt or gravel being moved, it was going to move it itself sooner or later. I would so love to see the regional areas self manage rather than being dictated to by people with no clue.
It's in the Mining Regulation, 2016, Redmanti.
12 Fossicking(Former clause 12 of 2010 Reg)
(1) A person who causes any soil, rock or other material to be disturbed in the course of work carried out for the purpose of fossicking for minerals must ensure that:
(a) the soil, rock or other material is removed and stockpiled separately, and
(b) after completion of the work, the soil, rock or other material is replaced in order to reconstruct the original soil profile.
Maximum penalty: 50 penalty units.
(2) A person must not carry out work that includes any of the following activities for the purpose of fossicking:
(a) the use of any equipment other than hand-held implements on any land or waters that is subject to native title,
(b) the excavation or clearing of any land or waters that is subject to native title,
(c) the use of power-operated equipment for the purpose of surface disturbance, excavation or processing on any land,
(d) the use of explosives on any land,
(e) the damage or removal of any bushrock,
(f) the removal of more than the prescribed amount of material from any land during any single period of 48 hours,
(g) the disturbance of more than 1 cubic metre of any soil, rock or other material during any single period of 48 hours.
Maximum penalty: 50 penalty units.
Note. The language of part of this subclause mirrors the language of part of section 24LA (Low impact future acts) of the Native Title Act 1993 of the Commonwealth. That section refers, in part, to an act (in relation to particular land or waters) that does not consist of, authorise or otherwise involve the excavation or clearing of any of the land or waters or mining (other than fossicking by using hand-held implements).
(3) In this clause:
gemstone means a Group 6 or Group 7 mineral.
Note. Group 6 and Group 7 minerals are listed in Schedule 2.
power-operated equipment means any equipment powered by mechanical or electrical means.
prescribed amount, in relation to material, means:
(a) 10 kilograms of mineral-bearing material (other than the material referred to in paragraphs (b)(e)), or
(b) 5 kilograms of minerals (other than gold or gemstones), or
(c) 50 grams of gold (except where found as nuggets of 10 grams or greater), or
(d) 5 nuggets of 10 grams or greater of gold, or
(e) 100 grams of gemstones.
The wording of the 2003 regulation was a bit different, and did not explicitly mention processing:
MINING REGULATION 2003 - REG 11
Fossicking
11 Fossicking
(1) A person must not:
(a) fossick for minerals using explosives, power-operated equipment or any other equipment except hand-held implements, or
(b) in the course of fossicking for minerals:
(i) excavate or clear any land or waters, or
(ii) damage any bushrock or remove any bushrock from the site, or
(c) in the course of fossicking for minerals, remove more than:
(i) 25 kilograms of minerals (other than gold or gemstones), or
(ii) 50 grams of gold (except where found as nuggets of 10 grams or greater), or
(iii) 100 grams of gemstones,
during any single period of 48 hours, or
(d) fail to replace (where practicable) any soil, rock or other material that the person has disturbed in the course of fossicking for minerals.
Maximum penalty: 50 penalty units.
Note: The language of part of this subclause mirrors the language of part of section 24LA (Low impact future acts) of the Native Title Act 1993 of the Commonwealth. That section refers, in part, to an act (in relation to particular land or waters) that does not consist of, authorise or otherwise involve the excavation or clearing of any of the land or waters or mining (other than fossicking by using hand-held implements).
(2) In this clause, "gemstone" means a Group 6 or Group 7 mineral.
Note: Group 6 and Group 7 minerals are listed in Schedule 3.
12 Fossicking(Former clause 12 of 2010 Reg)
(1) A person who causes any soil, rock or other material to be disturbed in the course of work carried out for the purpose of fossicking for minerals must ensure that:
(a) the soil, rock or other material is removed and stockpiled separately, and
(b) after completion of the work, the soil, rock or other material is replaced in order to reconstruct the original soil profile.
Maximum penalty: 50 penalty units.
(2) A person must not carry out work that includes any of the following activities for the purpose of fossicking:
(a) the use of any equipment other than hand-held implements on any land or waters that is subject to native title,
(b) the excavation or clearing of any land or waters that is subject to native title,
(c) the use of power-operated equipment for the purpose of surface disturbance, excavation or processing on any land,
(d) the use of explosives on any land,
(e) the damage or removal of any bushrock,
(f) the removal of more than the prescribed amount of material from any land during any single period of 48 hours,
(g) the disturbance of more than 1 cubic metre of any soil, rock or other material during any single period of 48 hours.
Maximum penalty: 50 penalty units.
Note. The language of part of this subclause mirrors the language of part of section 24LA (Low impact future acts) of the Native Title Act 1993 of the Commonwealth. That section refers, in part, to an act (in relation to particular land or waters) that does not consist of, authorise or otherwise involve the excavation or clearing of any of the land or waters or mining (other than fossicking by using hand-held implements).
(3) In this clause:
gemstone means a Group 6 or Group 7 mineral.
Note. Group 6 and Group 7 minerals are listed in Schedule 2.
power-operated equipment means any equipment powered by mechanical or electrical means.
prescribed amount, in relation to material, means:
(a) 10 kilograms of mineral-bearing material (other than the material referred to in paragraphs (b)(e)), or
(b) 5 kilograms of minerals (other than gold or gemstones), or
(c) 50 grams of gold (except where found as nuggets of 10 grams or greater), or
(d) 5 nuggets of 10 grams or greater of gold, or
(e) 100 grams of gemstones.
The wording of the 2003 regulation was a bit different, and did not explicitly mention processing:
MINING REGULATION 2003 - REG 11
Fossicking
11 Fossicking
(1) A person must not:
(a) fossick for minerals using explosives, power-operated equipment or any other equipment except hand-held implements, or
(b) in the course of fossicking for minerals:
(i) excavate or clear any land or waters, or
(ii) damage any bushrock or remove any bushrock from the site, or
(c) in the course of fossicking for minerals, remove more than:
(i) 25 kilograms of minerals (other than gold or gemstones), or
(ii) 50 grams of gold (except where found as nuggets of 10 grams or greater), or
(iii) 100 grams of gemstones,
during any single period of 48 hours, or
(d) fail to replace (where practicable) any soil, rock or other material that the person has disturbed in the course of fossicking for minerals.
Maximum penalty: 50 penalty units.
Note: The language of part of this subclause mirrors the language of part of section 24LA (Low impact future acts) of the Native Title Act 1993 of the Commonwealth. That section refers, in part, to an act (in relation to particular land or waters) that does not consist of, authorise or otherwise involve the excavation or clearing of any of the land or waters or mining (other than fossicking by using hand-held implements).
(2) In this clause, "gemstone" means a Group 6 or Group 7 mineral.
Note: Group 6 and Group 7 minerals are listed in Schedule 3.
Nor do some internet youtube fossickers making more money from broadcasting what and WHERE they find stuff then actual gold . Ive seen multiple areas raped from 1 person alone providing everything but gps co-ordinatesmbasko said:
Guy's if you do not belong to NAPFA pleas join weather you use a banker or not rally with us please we do need your help. When NAPFA started the stick they wielded was only small but with each new member that stick gets a little longer and thicker. Then WE CAN STAND AS ONE.
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GaryO said:Nor do some internet youtube fossickers making more money from broadcasting what and WHERE they find stuff then actual gold . Ive seen multiple areas raped from 1 person alone providing everything but gps co-ordinatesmbasko said:
Know what you mean. One YouTube fossicker makes my blood boil when I watch them rape and pillage the Aussie bush and streams. No respect. Can't bare to even hear their voice
.
Im sure i know who.
Its no longer a hobby that we all enjoy.. its an Internet cash cow.
We need to gather on mass in one place with our equipment and call in the media.
Defy the BS regulation and get attention and have the media report our position, on why this change of wording should be struck down.
We need to contact business like sluicey gold sluices , Central west Prospecting and any others that benefit from our patronage to get involved.
Defy the BS regulation and get attention and have the media report our position, on why this change of wording should be struck down.
We need to contact business like sluicey gold sluices , Central west Prospecting and any others that benefit from our patronage to get involved.
Gaining Approval for a march on ,say Parliament House in Sydney is Quite Easy... No Hoops and Hurdles and a very easy Process, Well it was when we Organised Marches with 20,000 Construction Workers... Main thing is you Need Cops Approval which in Most cases is Granted. And You Get an Escort Thrown in as well :lol: ... And Play it Cool... You Will get Idiots wanting to start Crap but because We were there for the same reason 'the Group" kept it in Line....
LW...
LW...
Here is some info on Marches in Sydney....
http://www.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/...notifications/public-addresses-and-assemblies
https://www.ourcommunity.com.au/advocacy/advocacy_article.jsp?articleId=2411
LW...
http://www.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/...notifications/public-addresses-and-assemblies
https://www.ourcommunity.com.au/advocacy/advocacy_article.jsp?articleId=2411
LW...
