winch isolator correct way to wire.

After working on a friends 4x4. I noticed his isolator switch was connected via the negative pole. This is the standard way most vehicles will be wired up for total isolation.
But NOT your winch.
Secondly he had it on the bar itself. WRONG again.
Why.....
firstly, if you submersed you vehicle in a creek crossing, and you have no isolation, water can make a contact current to the negative poles on the solenoid(s).
Thus your winch can automatically startcranking in by itself, destroying the winch, and depending on where you keep your hook, bending your bar.
if you have an isolator hooked up through the negative, this can still happen with the negative running up the the bar/ vehicle.
But with isolating the positive, this can't really happen.
handy place for the isolator on the bar, but again if submersed, the current will bypass the switch. So up high and dry in the engine bay.
Tip....
a male and female 7 pin trailer connectors are a good bayonet behind the bar, connecting blinkers, spot lights etc. A simple seperation if you ever need to split the bar the vehicle.

If your winching from the drivers seat , you should have a solenoid as an isolator and a switch in the dash . Because if your remote fails you need to be able to stop winching :Y:

Good idea if using a corded remote ................... wireless remote malfunction ................. just smash it on the dash .............. instant fix .... no more signal :|
Regards salt water .................. also much more conductive than fresh due to salt content :Y:

Covered in next post :Y:

It would be like an angry brown bear climbing up a tree. Ha. Good point!
And yes it's been that long since I've seen the beach, I forgotten about salt water! Maybe best just for bush 4x4's.
One thing I forgot to mention is after a decent long work out with your winch, dont turn your vehicle of for a while, as these things suck some serious juice out of your battery. Let it idol for a bit before you have your celebrational beer after getting out of that ditch.

ok, with the winch starting by itself. The contact poles/terminals on the solenoid are the issue here. Where the signal wire power comes into place. That is the trigger to move the winch.
Getting this part totally wet is amost identical to hot wiring a starter motor.
if you had the isolator on the negative feed. Submersed the negative can be bypassed up through the bar and chassis. As you will also have a negative feed from your battery to the engine and chassis.
But with the positive isolated, there is no positive ( power) down there to complete the circut. Just a negative (earth).
I can be a shocker at explaining things sometimes, so if there is any confusion still. Post saying such. And I am welcome for others to fill in the gaps.
Hope it helps but.

All good Mudgee :Y: .................... not sure I'd be as happy as the bloke in pic above post standing beside my 4B hanging from a tree
Watching it being retrieved would be fun I'd reckon

To tell the truth I mainly use mine for moving the big rock a bit, to get some hidden goodies.
but it is very handy to have a split pully unit, as often you will not find a tree dead center in the middle of the road for a direct straight pull.
With these, you can anchor to a tree say on your left, then inbetween with another strap, connect to a tree off to the right, with the pully wheel over your draw cable to center the line the pull up the track, rather than being dragged off to one side.

Mate a winch is the handiest piece of kit you can have .......................... at the low prices you can get them for now ............... cheap as chips.
Just finished fitting this 13000 get out of jail unit to the new :| "Fraser Beast" @ $350 with Dyneema rope and winch plate ................ bargain :Y: I have a $2500 Warn on my other 4x4 .............. wouldn't do it again



You can buy 6 of the above for the price of this

Sweet! You would have to be a crazy 4x4 man to ever wear a winch out! That's good value! Why do I think of Russia when ever I see a pic like that? Haha

Bogger said:

Good idea if using a corded remote ................... wireless remote malfunction ................. just smash it on the dash .............. instant fix .... no more signal :|
Regards salt water .................. also much more conductive than fresh due to salt content :Y:

Covered in next post :Y:

https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/img/member-images/7268/1521584412_tree_4x4.jpg

https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/img/member-images/7268/1521584568_tree_2.jpg

Click to expand...

Reminds me of the scene in "The Gods Must Be Crazy" 8) when he accidentally winched his old LandRover up the tree.

Cheers

Doug

mudgee hunter said:

After working on a friends 4x4. I noticed his isolator switch was connected via the negative pole. This is the standard way most vehicles will be wired up for total isolation.
But NOT your winch.
Secondly he had it on the bar itself. WRONG again.
Why.....
firstly, if you submersed you vehicle in a creek crossing, and you have no isolation, water can make a contact current to the negative poles on the solenoid(s).
Thus your winch can automatically startcranking in by itself, destroying the winch, and depending on where you keep your hook, bending your bar.
if you have an isolator hooked up through the negative, this can still happen with the negative running up the the bar/ vehicle.
But with isolating the positive, this can't really happen.
handy place for the isolator on the bar, but again if submersed, the current will bypass the switch. So up high and dry in the engine bay.
Tip....
a male and female 7 pin trailer connectors are a good bayonet behind the bar, connecting blinkers, spot lights etc. A simple seperation if you ever need to split the bar the vehicle.

Click to expand...

The reason for the negative isolation is so that the poles on the isolator can be contacted (shorted) with the body and the only thing that happens is that the winch is enabled. If the positive is switched the poles on the isolator have the potential to short circuit the battery and with the full battery power available (upwards of 600CCA) this is not going to end well. The winch will not work until the solenoid is activated. The amount of current flow through an isolator switch in salt water would not be enough to have the winch move whatsoever, it may however be enough to operate the solenoid. Ken.

Myself I'd run it on the pos side, as my line of thought is a metre or so of constant live cable to winch from the pos side, has a higher risk to short than live solenoid terminal points. Even more so in the event of any collision. In saying that I don't run one ................. just another point for corrosion and voltage drop. But my vehicle sees heavy salt use which is most unkind to anything electrical, especially terminals and contacts . Just disconnecting the power lead when not required, following the KISS principle is probably the least expensive and also most effective. But like most things pros and cons for all I guess and one can only pick what may best suit the environment and conditions it is going to be operated in :/
This control box is only 6 months old and the solenoid mount brackets are nearly gone already with all terminals showing signs.



Any posts on circuit breakers, solenoids etc I cover with a bit of vac line to minimise accidental shorting. Simple but effective

Can I see a few pics of the Winch Plate Mounts Bogger..... You have me thinking about the Alloy Bar now...

LW.....

LoneWolf said:

Can I see a few pics of the Winch Plate Mounts Bogger..... You have me thinking about the Alloy Bar now...

LW.....

Click to expand...

Here is winch plate $47 posted, I just cut to length and weld into chassis rails ...................... on the $500 wonder truck all good :Y: :Y: :Y:
Winch cost nearly as much as the car Lucky you can unbolt it
Will find some bare pics of plate before winch
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/BRAND-N...725954?hash=item4b2f192bc2:g:bVUAAOxyQj9RKhBj

I use something similar to this https://www.ebay.com.au/i/351293999400?chn=ps&dispItem=1
It's pretty rare to need the winch and you normally know prior to needing it, so it's left off, if some section looks iffy I key it on and get the cable remote ready.

Bogger said:

Myself I'd run it on the pos side, as my line of thought is a metre or so of constant live cable to winch from the pos side, has a higher risk to short than live solenoid terminal points. Even more so in the event of any collision. In saying that I don't run one ................. just another point for corrosion and voltage drop. But my vehicle sees heavy salt use which is most unkind to anything electrical, especially terminals and contacts . Just disconnecting the power lead when not required, following the KISS principle is probably the least expensive and also most effective. But like most things pros and cons for all I guess and one can only pick what may best suit the environment and conditions it is going to be operated in :/
This control box is only 6 months old and the solenoid mount brackets are nearly gone already with all terminals showing signs.

https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/img/member-images/7268/1521754692_winch_control_box.jpg

Any posts on circuit breakers, solenoids etc I cover with a bit of vac line to minimise accidental shorting. Simple but effective

https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/img/member-images/7268/1521755203_contact_protection.jpg

Click to expand...

just got a near new runva xp11 for a bargain,some good tips here fellas,bogger a bit of battery terminal spray might protect them contacts a bit better,im gonna order this narva isolater....

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com.au/ulk/itm/182836238878

Drown it with Inox mate. Great stuff. Get the can that has the electrical parts diagram on it. I buy it it the 5ltr container and pour it an engine cleaning air gun, and blow it all under the 4x4. Then feather it in with an air pistol. Ants pants for rust.

The current of 12v running through water to activate the winch motor itself is NOT the issue!
This would take a miracle to happen.
It is the solenoid itself to "activate" the winch MOTOR momentarily, that is the problem!
If you understand how any relay switch box works, you might grasp the issue.
Has nothing to do with with water bridging a circuit between the winch motor itself.
That is near impossible in water.
The solenoid is a mere relay to activate/open the voltage to the winch motor!
Nothing else! But a heavy style of relay switch!
That can handle the current to make it work.
Water is not going to burn out making contact.
But they must be heavy duty to do so.
Have another look at the photos above of the "POSITIVE" side of the solenoid!
And think about what two or three seconds of being actuated does!
Where is your hook now!???
Over wound, ripping into your spindle axel.....
The solenoid is NOT the motor for the winch!
But just a heavy duty switch to turn the winch motor ON!
Exactly the same as the relay to crank your vehicle over!
Except without a fuse.
Amperage??? You can hot wire a truck with a paper clip!
By the ignition relay....
Jump starting a car needs at massive Amperage capacity.
Think some are getting things confused
The power is always ready to go in a winch, ( not fused ) except the switch/ solenoid is the link.
It is not the water bridging contact on the winch motor to activate it, but the switch/ solenoid. Hot wire/ tricks it....
And the winch starts.
No positive... no problems.
Think about it this way, your " isolator switch is only killing power /current to the "negative" side of the lighter wiriing to the SOLENOID!
Not the winch motor...
Your whole vehicle is a negative!