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#326

ctxkid
Member
From: Up Ship Creek
Joined: 12 April 2018
Posts: 2,263
Member
17 December 2019 10:59 am

big bucks lithium may be yikes

but consider you will see your way through 3-4 maybe more lead agm's in the "life time" of a single lithium perfect money

new generation lithium such as Invicta inlove are drop in replacement cool power perfect

the bluetooth features are built in heart

where as you will pay upward of $300 to get the same info from an add on , such as a victron bmv702 thumbsup

so thinking of the plus sides to lithium the bitterness of price is far offset by the sweetness of functionality cool power power

Last edited by ctxkid (17 December 2019 11:01 am)


...................................................Such is life........................................................
Oldest Copper coin 1799 left seated half penny, Oldest Silver 1834 Shilling

1 user likes this post: grubstake

#327

condor22
Member
From: Adelaide, SA
Joined: 16 December 2013
Posts: 1,870
Member
17 December 2019 11:22 am

Grubstake, your Xmas trial will be eagerly awaited. This battery type and price is now well in the range of replacing a 100AH AGM in a 4x4. Lighter, more usable power and a similar price.

What will you be charging it with? smile

2 users like this post: RM Outback, ctxkid

#328

RM Outback
Member
Joined: 10 March 2016
Posts: 5,650
Member
17 December 2019 11:24 am

condor22 wrote:

Grubstake, your Xmas trial will be eagerly awaited. This battery type and price is now well in the range of replacing a 100AH AGM in a 4x4. Lighter, more usable power and a similar price.

What will you be charging it with? smile

I'm keen to hear how it pan's out, sure is a reasonable price for the life expectancy.

#329

grubstake
Member
From: Perth, WA
Joined: 20 October 2014
Posts: 2,419
Member
17 December 2019 12:33 pm

condor22 wrote:

Grubstake, your Xmas trial will be eagerly awaited. This battery type and price is now well in the range of replacing a 100AH AGM in a 4x4. Lighter, more usable power and a similar price.

What will you be charging it with? smile

Exactly - in five years time I'd guess that lead acids will be extinct for recreational/back-up purposes.

My one is going into an Ark Pak AP730 battery box (which is identical to the Engel Series II and the Thunder TDR16 battery boxes). This model has added LiFePO4 charging capability to its menus/firmware, although I'm not even sure that these latest lithiums even care - they all claim to have inbuilt Battery Management Systems that make them a plug and play substitute for the old lead acids.


Where it is, there it is.

#330

Goldchaser1
Member
From: Kalgoorlie, WA
Joined: 28 February 2017
Posts: 977
Member
17 December 2019 01:22 pm

grubstake wrote:
condor22 wrote:

Grubstake, your Xmas trial will be eagerly awaited. This battery type and price is now well in the range of replacing a 100AH AGM in a 4x4. Lighter, more usable power and a similar price.

What will you be charging it with? smile

Exactly - in five years time I'd guess that lead acids will be extinct for recreational/back-up purposes.

My one is going into an Ark Pak AP730 battery box (which is identical to the Engel Series II and the Thunder TDR16 battery boxes). This model has added LiFePO4 charging capability to its menus/firmware, although I'm not even sure that these latest lithiums even care - they all claim to have inbuilt Battery Management Systems that make them a plug and play substitute for the old lead acids.

Thinking ya won’t look back after using it for a bit grubstake,there a good thing for the bush,they run rings around conventional batteries.....

1 user likes this post: grubstake

#331

ctxkid
Member
From: Up Ship Creek
Joined: 12 April 2018
Posts: 2,263
Member
17 December 2019 01:59 pm

grubstake wrote:

I just picked up a 75Ah LiFePO4 12V battery for $450 on eBay and am looking forward to trialling it in the bush over Xmas/New Year. It only weighs 5-6kg, so no more risk of hernia moving it around. thumbsup

it will make you smile cool

Last edited by ctxkid (17 December 2019 02:00 pm)


...................................................Such is life........................................................
Oldest Copper coin 1799 left seated half penny, Oldest Silver 1834 Shilling

#332

condor22
Member
From: Adelaide, SA
Joined: 16 December 2013
Posts: 1,870
Member
17 December 2019 05:36 pm

So, the expected 40C in Adelaide today, so far is above 38C in town. However I'm near the beach.

I went out about 2 hours ago, the outside temp was 34C, but my fridge thermometer in the car showed the temp in the car at 49+C.

I'd expect that to be much higher if it was 40+C outside,

So for those running Lithium, how do they react to being charged at higher temps? smile

1 user likes this post: Ridge Runner

#333

Ridge Runner
Member
Joined: 04 September 2014
Posts: 6,572
Member
17 December 2019 05:44 pm

That's a great deal for a Lithium battery of that size, good luck let us know how it works for you,

Because there are So many types of batteries out there now , I bought a few of the NOCO smart Chargers, the G3500 and the G15000 and for bigger batteries I got the G26000, These things also have a boost start mode, which can be used in an emergency up to Twice in 24 hours, The G15000 will Start a Semi and So will the G26000

But for jump starting this week I just bought the NOCO Boost Pro GB150 and the GB70 as a backup,

Here a short video of the NOCO G26000 Battery Charger "In Australia" It's Beast of a thing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6cu_nxZvEyA

And here's a Video of the G15000 Charger starting a Semi,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Z0y5-xpIc4

Last edited by Ridge Runner (17 December 2019 05:47 pm)


AKA, Fridge Runner....

#334

Goldchaser1
Member
From: Kalgoorlie, WA
Joined: 28 February 2017
Posts: 977
Member
17 December 2019 06:04 pm

condor22 wrote:

So, the expected 40C in Adelaide today, so far is above 38C in town. However I'm near the beach.

I went out about 2 hours ago, the outside temp was 34C, but my fridge thermometer in the car showed the temp in the car at 49+C.

I'd expect that to be much higher if it was 40+C outside,

So for those running Lithium, how do they react to being charged at higher temps? smile

40c shouldnt effect them,why has someone had troubles in the heat with them?

1 user likes this post: ctxkid

#335

ctxkid
Member
From: Up Ship Creek
Joined: 12 April 2018
Posts: 2,263
Member
17 December 2019 06:09 pm

Goldchaser1 wrote:
condor22 wrote:

So, the expected 40C in Adelaide today, so far is above 38C in town. However I'm near the beach.

I went out about 2 hours ago, the outside temp was 34C, but my fridge thermometer in the car showed the temp in the car at 49+C.

I'd expect that to be much higher if it was 40+C outside,

So for those running Lithium, how do they react to being charged at higher temps? smile

40c shouldnt effect them,why has someone had troubles in the heat with them?

80 and over might be a drama ops

haven't heard anyone with heat worries cool


...................................................Such is life........................................................
Oldest Copper coin 1799 left seated half penny, Oldest Silver 1834 Shilling

#336

Ridge Runner
Member
Joined: 04 September 2014
Posts: 6,572
Member
17 December 2019 06:15 pm

I read that the Storage and use Temps for Lithium batteries varied from -20 to 50*c depending on the brand, ??


AKA, Fridge Runner....

#337

Goldchaser1
Member
From: Kalgoorlie, WA
Joined: 28 February 2017
Posts: 977
Member
17 December 2019 06:16 pm

ctxkid wrote:
Goldchaser1 wrote:
condor22 wrote:

So, the expected 40C in Adelaide today, so far is above 38C in town. However I'm near the beach.

I went out about 2 hours ago, the outside temp was 34C, but my fridge thermometer in the car showed the temp in the car at 49+C.

I'd expect that to be much higher if it was 40+C outside,

So for those running Lithium, how do they react to being charged at higher temps? smile

40c shouldnt effect them,why has someone had troubles in the heat with them?

80 and over might be a drama ops

haven't heard anyone with heat worries cool

Im a bit sceptical ctx on how theyd go under a bonnet in our summer temps,we put one in our quad last year,its goin ok,sees more heat then the camper batteries.....

#338

ctxkid
Member
From: Up Ship Creek
Joined: 12 April 2018
Posts: 2,263
Member
17 December 2019 07:22 pm

Goldchaser1 wrote:

Im a bit sceptical ctx on how theyd go under a bonnet in our summer temps,we put one in our quad last year,its goin ok,sees more heat then the camper batteries.....

the under bonnet lithium is not a reality yet , it is on the horizon
motorcycles and quads and stuff are a different story , i have them in all my big bikes and so far they are amasing
when they get them right for cars , it will be a real game changer


...................................................Such is life........................................................
Oldest Copper coin 1799 left seated half penny, Oldest Silver 1834 Shilling

1 user likes this post: Goldchaser1

#339

BigWave
Member
From: Melbourne
Joined: 19 January 2016
Posts: 4,033
Member
17 December 2019 08:15 pm

I tried a Lithium one in my Suzi GSX1400.
Great for starting but few Ahs, so if you need to stop with parkers and hazards on, you don't have very long.
Maybe that's also changed now, but very few (none that I could find) would advertise their Ah, only their CCA.


GPX-4500 & Direction Finding Daughter

#340

mudgee hunter
Member
Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 1,902
Member
18 December 2019 12:34 am

Thinking they would have to be rated about 100C to go next to a motor!
Gets Bloody hot under there. Even then, at 100c top rated, it would be getting on its limits.
Mind you, those little BMW coupes have their battery in the boot.
And they don't even come with a Jack or a spare tyre! yikes

Last edited by mudgee hunter (18 December 2019 12:36 am)


Member of the "Banker Gang"

#341

ctxkid
Member
From: Up Ship Creek
Joined: 12 April 2018
Posts: 2,263
Member
18 December 2019 06:48 am

BigWave wrote:

I tried a Lithium one in my Suzi GSX1400.
Great for starting but few Ahs, so if you need to stop with parkers and hazards on, you don't have very long.
Maybe that's also changed now, but very few (none that I could find) would advertise their Ah, only their CCA.

i too have a 1400 cool and i have one of these in it (not this one) it spins the starter like it has no plugs in power power power
it has the info on it Bigwave thumbsup
i cannot recommend Super Sport lithium higher perfect heart cool
1576611906_img_20190403_114611.jpg

i can supply and post smile

Last edited by ctxkid (18 December 2019 06:57 am)


...................................................Such is life........................................................
Oldest Copper coin 1799 left seated half penny, Oldest Silver 1834 Shilling

1 user likes this post: pinfire opals

#342

ctxkid
Member
From: Up Ship Creek
Joined: 12 April 2018
Posts: 2,263
Member
18 December 2019 06:54 am

here's one i put in a harley

1576612420_img_20190726_152932.jpg
1576612420_img_20190726_153932.jpg


...................................................Such is life........................................................
Oldest Copper coin 1799 left seated half penny, Oldest Silver 1834 Shilling

2 users like this post: pinfire opals, mudgee hunter

#343

Goldchaser1
Member
From: Kalgoorlie, WA
Joined: 28 February 2017
Posts: 977
Member
18 December 2019 07:38 am

Like the one i threw in our polaris,much smaller then the original,when i put it in last march or april i must of left the ignition switched to on,4-5 days later went to fire it up,mmmm flat,checked it out,0 volts,threw it on a panel for a few days then quad fired and we used it all season,wasnt a problem,its a wonder i didnt do the coil on the motor. hmm
Yeah cranks like its on steroids to......

Last edited by Goldchaser1 (18 December 2019 07:40 am)

1 user likes this post: ctxkid

#344

condor22
Member
From: Adelaide, SA
Joined: 16 December 2013
Posts: 1,870
Member
14 January 2020 12:18 am

So, took the old GEL to the scrap yard, got $12 for it by weight, lol. Then went and bought a new 100AH AGM. (Thumper Redback Extreme R.R.P. $419, I paid $320, so with the scrap value $308 for a reasonable quality battery, 2 yr warranty).

I'm over this hot weather, I get little done in the shed. But here's where I'm at with the solar fit etc.

I have the panel mounting etc fixed to the panel, ready to drill into the roof rack and fit it. Then a little "jigging" round to sort the wiring up top and into the car

Before then, going to wire up the new battery, fit the solar reg and the 10A circuit breaker so the battery is usable as it was before I buggered the old one.

As I'm using an earth into the roof rail, I only have one wire (+) to feed into the rear of the 4x4. It will go to the circuit breaker, which will all be wired up as noted. Then all I need to do is turn it on smile

#345

Ded Driver
Member
From: West of the Border, WA
Joined: 27 May 2018
Posts: 2,875
Member
14 January 2020 12:31 am

Condor22, I made telescopic pivoting legs for my solar panel. I can slip a swag in under it for travel, & in camp I can change the angle to better catch the morning sun if I want. Folds down flat normally.
can put some details on paper if you want it
https://www.prospectingaustralia.com.au … 22#p476422


APLA member, GPX4000, modded SD2100, XTerra705, GM1000, Whites MXT Pro, Nokta Pointer, sP01 Enhancer, Garmin GPSMAP 64S, kti PLB, a map, all sorts of coils & a cupla buckets full of hope & enthusiasm

1 user likes this post: Gem in I

#346

condor22
Member
From: Adelaide, SA
Joined: 16 December 2013
Posts: 1,870
Member
14 January 2020 12:06 pm

Thanks DED, I'd be interested in the details, thanks.

What I've done - My roof basket is 6mm narrower than the panels length, so I'm fitting it across the rack at the back. The back of the basket and panel will be flush and I'm fitting 4 hinges. At the front sides, I've bolted a 50 x 50 plate to the side of the panel and will bolt through it were it drops to the basket with a 5mm bolt either side with wing nut and spring washer.

Then I'll use these 2 points to put a 300 mm leg between them to prop up the panel at an angle when stopped. (MAYBE, lol)

I say maybe because, in my experience small panel output i.e. 100 to 200 W don't get that much benefit form angling with a PWM controller. So I'm confident that flat will suffice for my needs. Reason for the PWM, it came with the panel and cost is a factor, lol. Also.....

My van panels are flexible, glued to the van roof and flat but I have a MPPT controller on them. I use 35-40 AH in the van on average and the panels always do the job no matter the weather, but they are the best available panels.

It will be interesting to see what the Ridge Ryder 110W will do, but there are differences in use and other charging capability. The van battery needs a genny to be fired up to supplement panels if need be. I use a genny for other things most days, so the 240 VAC charger is used when I do regardless. In other words my primary charging is Solar supplemented by genny.

I don't use 240 VAC on the 4x4 AUX, but I do have the Redarc when driving. I drive most days when out there, but often not enough to fully charge. This, I see as, my primary charging is the Redarc and will be supplemented by Solar.

PS. I don't normally carry much on the basket. Once the panel is fixed, I'll be making brackets for the 4 Maxtrax locking pin mounts and they will sit across the front of the basket. The other thing I have carried up there are 3 x 20 lt water jerries (empty). These I use to augment my water supply and carry water from source to the van. As they are empty, tucking them into the shower cubicle is my alternative when travelling. They weigh bugger all empty. smile

PPS. I'll do the pics are worth a 1000 words of the install when it's done.

2 users like this post: madtuna, Ded Driver

#347

condor22
Member
From: Adelaide, SA
Joined: 16 December 2013
Posts: 1,870
Member
15 January 2020 04:52 pm

Got the Solar controller and CCT BKR installed today, all wired up (except panel + wire)
1579067059_solar_1.jpg
When I install the panel, as previously mentioned, the earth or - wire will go to the roof rail. The + wire will be fed into the rear end and terminate at the CCT BKR. Then just flick a switch when solar is wanted. smile

While at the car, I checked the battery voltage, the car has not been driven since mid afternoon yesterday, so the new battery has been at rest (no load) for near 24 hours.
Nice to see a decent voltage, the buggered battery was 12.5 V.
1579067664_bat_chk_1.jpg

THe Engel hasn't been on, so I turned it on and this was the result.
1579067680_bat_chk_2.jpg
The amperage is high, due to it working hard, but I know from past experience that once the fridge starts to cool down and is running normally, V drop, 2-9 to 3.1.
The other thing to note is that even with a 4.5 A load, Bat V remained the same, gotta luv a new battery. smile

Last edited by condor22 (15 January 2020 04:54 pm)

4 users like this post: Ded Driver, Jaros, Nightjar, Retirement Stone

#348

condor22
Member
From: Adelaide, SA
Joined: 16 December 2013
Posts: 1,870
Member
18 January 2020 02:18 pm

Some pics and explanation of why I did what. smile When I decided to fit a panel, I considered that for weight I did not carry much on the roof basket, Maxtrax and maybe empty water jerries, which I can carry elsewhere. However as I'm running 3.5 to 4 M of + cable, I want a fuse up top and the ability to reach it. I also wanted the abbility to angle the panel. The Ridge Ryder 110W panel is 6mm longer than the width of the basket and as the wiring is to the boot, it will be installed across the basket and at the rear of it. The frame of the basket is 18mm square tube with approx 75mm radii on the corners. It is made up of 2 'C' forms welded at the centre of the assy front and rear.
I don't want to flush the weld where the panel sits as it might weaken the joint.
1579316569_hinges.jpg
There are 4 hinges that fit to the rear face of the basket, the neoprene rubber spaces the panel to clear the weld and will also stop metal to metal rubbing.
1579316569_front_lug.jpg
I made up 2 plates that sit to the side of the basket, they also have neoprene on the inner face and this will accommodate the 6mm diffferene in panel length to basket width as well as padding. I may use a wing nut here if I decide to angle the panel, but for the first trip, I'll use a Nylock. I also riveted a 25x25x3 Alum Angle on the front of the panel - a. to give the leading edge more strength and b. to space the panel in consideration of the neoprene.
1579316569_cable.jpg
The panel came with a good length of cable and I wanted to minimise how much was cut off, so initially it goes forward from the junction box, has P clips and cable ties to then feed to the rear.
1579316569_mc4.jpg
I fed the cable back to the rear edge of the panel, fitted an inline waterproof fuse holder and then near to the rear driver side corner of the panel where a male and female MC4 connector were fitted. I used one of each so that polarity can't be mixed.

The rest will get sorted once it's on the roof. I decided to run 5mm twin core into the rear instead of using a roof rail for earth (-). The 5mm cable is the max dia that will fit in the solar controller or MC4 connector terminals. I got it at my auto sparky's for 2 reasons - a. Jaycar, Supercheap etc only stock 4 or 6mm and, b. he uses good quality cable that is better rated for UV degradation. More..... when it's done smile

Last edited by condor22 (18 January 2020 02:21 pm)

3 users like this post: Jaros, Nightjar, madtuna

#349

Nightjar
Member
From: Waikiki, WA
Joined: 26 September 2013
Posts: 1,554
Member
18 January 2020 02:33 pm

Coming along very well Condor, feel sure you will get a more reliable set up running an earth instead of connecting to frame.
Look forward t your completed project. thumbsup


Happy Hunting, Nightjar.

2 users like this post: robmoto, ctxkid

#350

condor22
Member
From: Adelaide, SA
Joined: 16 December 2013
Posts: 1,870
Member
18 January 2020 05:46 pm

Thanks NJ.

I ran that by the sparky when I bought the cable. I was looking at 4 mm - 15 A cable. I took the solar controller with me as it had the tightest terminals, we tried 4 and 5, both fit. So on the logic that bigger is better and 5 mm is 25 A so less voltage drop, I went that way. He also commented that even though a multi meter showed continuity on the roof rail earth point, he always runs twin cable direct so no argument. smile

By my calculation I get about a 1% or 0.18 V drop, so happy with that.

I also tried where the cable would run through the tailgate to roof gap to make sure it is loose and not trapped.

Thing I look forward to the most, is not having to plan a drive to charge the bloody battery smile


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