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#1

Northeast
Member
Joined: 27 August 2016
Posts: 1,087
Member
21 February 2019 05:20 pm

Howdy folks.

New QED owner and a reader of all things QED for a few weeks.

Been detecting for 3 years and have owned a GPZ 7000 and an SDC 2300, added a Gold Monster and then added an Equinox. A little background as to how I have ended up with a QED (and the Equinox).

Sold the SDC early on as realised that the GPZ will get things easily as small as the SDC but also a lot deeper. And it will get the real deep, big stuff also.

The Gold Monster was just for a bit of fun and something for family and friends to use if they came out. It worked well but when I got the Equinox I soon realised the Equinox was just as capable on small gold and far more versatile across many more uses (coins, jewellery, beach, etc). The Equinox really is a fantastic, light weight detector. Probably the one that I have enjoyed using the most.

The GPZ finally got sold with a few months warranty left on it as it just wasn’t getting used enough to justify $9,500 sitting in the cupboard.

But I still wanted something that I could use when I did get the time to get out, something lighter than the GPZ and something at a much more sensible price. I am on a couple of forums that JR Beatty and Reg Wilson frequent and if experienced blokes like those 2 felt the QED was capable then it seemed worth a try.

I received the QED on Monday. Purchased through Maldon Gold Centre but it is a Detech package put together by Stinky Pete at Detech with an 11” Ultra Sensing Coil.

I have obviously got weak from swinging the Equinox (1.34 KG) as I was expecting the QED to feel a bit lighter although it is only 2.15 kg itself. Nothing compared to swinging the GPZ though (3.32 kg).

Everything charged up and have had the last 2 days off to play. Having read lots on AEGPF and never having used a GP/GPX series or a Garret, etc, P.I. machine I felt that I might have things a little easier in that I wouldn’t have to unlearn old thinking and start again. This was sort of the case…

Day 1 – about 4 hours total at 2 different locations that I have found small gold (up to 1 gram) and have flogged pretty well with the GPZ, SDC and Gold Monster. Considering this I was not expecting to find any targets at all.

For the life of me I could not get a steady threshold, the EMI seemed all over the place, ground balance was hard to get right, I was ground balancing often and I did “Factory Default” about 8 times for the day just to re-start things from afresh. Tried different modes, different THS A, THS B – nothing helped! I did find 1 larger than average shot gun pellet but that was it. It was an ordinary day.

I was using the supplied speaker with the supplied cable for my audio. In terms of ergonomics and catching on things I’m sorry to say but it is poor. It is only a matter of time before the 6.5mm to 2.5 mm adaptor sticking out of the battery box gets caught on something and bends/breaks.

Came home last night a little frustrated but knowing that there must be something that can be changed to improve the situation. A little more reading on AEGPF last night.

Day 2 – Went back to spot number 2 that I had gone yesterday. Started the machine up with a ‘Factory Default’ and set it up in what I hoped was the right fashion. Same thing as yesterday…bugger! Persevered for 10 minutes and turned the speaker off, unplugged it and directly plugged in some Philips sports earbuds that I originally purchased to run off the WM-12 of the GPZ.

WELL!!! The difference was chalk and cheese! A steady threshold, a ground balance that was easy to identify and it held. I turned the THS A down 5 notches and the THS B also down 1 notch and the QED purred along.

In the same place that I had found almost nothing yesterday I found what you can see in the photo. Some on the surface and some at depth. Deepest target was a nail at approx 7-8 inches. The GPZ absolutely loved lead shot so I was very surprised to find any of that. And if I am finding lead shot I am confident that it will find gold if the coil passes over.

Audio – whatever your personal desire it’s obvious the QED needs quality audio. Personally I hate being tethered to a detector and will soon change to wireless.

Some of the smaller shot close to the coil gave what you might call a usual ‘sound response’ – a little ‘wheee’ as the coil passed over. I have seen comments on AEGPF about the pitch change and the volume change on targets. I found this on the deeper targets. As the coil edge hit the target there was a slight raise in volume, but then a change in pitch that dipped below threshold and then volume returned at the other edge of the coil. All easily heard with the wired ear buds in.

Performance – apart from the SDC this is the first time I have used a PI machine. The SDC was fool proof but also ungainly and limited in its versatility. The QED has shown me that it will find small lead shot and will find it going over the same ground that other, more expensive machines, have covered pretty thoroughly. I don’t feel that this makes the QED particularly better as all machines miss some targets, but it obviously has a point of difference and should be more than capable at finding small gold. Although, this is not the purpose for which I have bought a QED.

I did have some issues with a patch of ground that was compacted white clay. Was signalling off across much of it although they were broader signals that were not responding like a specific target. Once dug and broken up the signal dissipated. Due to it having such variability it was hard to Ground Balance that particular spot but that might come with practice and adaption.

With the audio issue under control I am happy with performance so far and am keen to use a variety of coils that some friends have to see what will work well, play with different modes, etc.

NE.

1550729978_qed_1st_day.jpg

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#2

roddosnow
Member
Joined: 19 March 2014
Posts: 67
Member
22 March 2019 12:46 pm

How is it going Northeast? have you found any yellow with the QED yet?

#3

Northeast
Member
Joined: 27 August 2016
Posts: 1,087
Member
23 March 2019 01:00 am

Hi Roddosnow.

Very little time to use it so far - maybe put in 10 hours all up.

Have got the Quest wireless setup from PhaseTech and it works a treat, just as Reg said it would wink

Also got a 20” nugget finder advantage and a Sadie coil off PT and have made sure they work and put in about 2 hours with the 20”.

Found some nice lead targets at a bit of depth with it and a few shallow targets as well.

I’m doing a lot of playing around with what mode to use, ground balance settings, trying a high or low Threshold B before digging a signal, trying the 4 GB points up or down to determine if something is hit ground or a target, etc.

The big NF coil feels beautifully weighted on the QED. Actually feels lighter than the 11” Detech although it isn’t.

Rather than ‘having trouble with’ I am perhaps not working out how to increase gain. Anything above 2 on any coil and I’m getting quite a bit of EMI.

It is certainly different to any other detector I’ve used so there is a lot more to learn but so far I have been surprised by a few finds I have had in places there should not have been many, if any, lead targets left.

The fact that I haven’t been able to get out much and use a new toy just reinforces the fact of why I sold the Z. And so far the QED has shown it is a capable machine at a reasonable price point.

I need to do a lot more testing before I come out and say “I love it” and there are pros and cons but I do have 2 days off this coming week. I would like to think I can get another 10 hrs in.

Getting the wireless system has been the biggest bonus. Being wired was putting me off using it!

Will certainly report more when I am confident in what I am reporting thumbsup

Last edited by Northeast (23 March 2019 01:02 am)

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#4

Northeast
Member
Joined: 27 August 2016
Posts: 1,087
Member
01 April 2019 11:13 pm

So, I've had a bit more of a play.

I mentioned I had 2 days off last week. Never happened. 10 hours to work it out? HA!!! Got about 2 hours Saturday and another 2 hours yesterday. But it's better than nothing.

I still haven't found any gold but I am going back over small areas of ground that have seen most of my previous detectors and lord knows how many detectors of other people.

So what have I learn't?

I really like the 20" Nugget Finder Advantage perfect Good coverage, light, doesn't pick up lead shot, runs nicely with the QED. I do struggle to get above 2 Gain but I suppose the big coil is a big antenna and a high Gain will just accentuate that. I recognise that missing lead shot means missing small gold. It is missing lead shot but it is banging on .22 projectile's. So if am getting a lot of the 1-2 gram plus pieces I will live with missing a couple of sub gram pieces and also not having to dig hundreds of lead shot. It is a trade off but one I am happy to make.

Ground Balance - I've never had a machine that hasn't had Tracking. Previous units were an initial ground balance and then leave it in Tracking if you preferred (I always preferred smile ). Manual Ground Balance and re-balance when necessary is the only option with the QED. Surprisingly, I like it! I've also read the recent thread about Ground Balancing the GPX and how many have stated they prefer leaving it in manual as they get to hear when the ground changes. The QED is the same. And I will be honest, I was never in tune to these changes when using the GPZ in tracking. Will it make a difference to my success? Maybe, maybe not.

Hot ground - I suppose this follows on from Ground Balance. A couple of the spots I have swung over have some real hard packed, white clay type stuff that once broken up is also a little powdery. The QED has sounded off a bit on these with both the 20" NF and the Detech 11" Ultra Sensing. One spot yesterday had this stuff and once the hole was dug there was also a clump of a red , mineralised material in it. Very much sounded like a nice target but once the hole was dug and the material broken up it all just dissipated into broad, irregular, quieter signals. I read of lots of people digging ground noise with PI's so I guess this is no different.

The one thing I have tried with almost every target the last few days is the 'moving the Ground Balance number up or down 4 places and seeing what the signal does'. Reg has mentioned this before.
So far I have only had 1 signal where this has actually not worked and it was the white stuff with the red centre that I mentioned above - I had to move it 10 places down before it disappeared. Every other target that has maintained a signal has been an actual target and every target that has disappeared has ended up being ground noise. Generally when the ground balance number has been moved down 4 spots, the ground noise signal has disappeared. I think Howard (inventor) has mentioned in his videos to move it up or down depending on the pitch of the signal. I have just done it both ways to see what happens. And yes, I have dug every signal that I have tried this on because I did not trust it in any way lol

Mode - I have been running it on 15 with the 20". Why? Mainly because the manual says that larger coils generally require a higher Mode (8-15). It has run nicely on 15 so have mostly left it there. Need to experiment more with other modes though.

Previously left it on Mode 3 with the Detech 11". I'm guessing I might be able to get Mode down to 1 with the Sadie but other than attaching the Sadie and making sure it worked I haven't used it.

THS B - This is an interesting little setting. I'm not particularly confident with leaving it at the Null point. Considering I'm using the large coil, the high Mode and searching for bigger targets using the higher area of the THS-B seemed like the go. Tested various signals before digging them seeing if I might be able to work out the size of the target depending on their response to either a high, low or null THS-B. This sort of worked but more interestingly this is what led me to not having confidence in the Null point.
The last 2 days with the 20" I have found the best THS-B to be at 53 on the higher end and 40 on the lower end. The response would change at either point depending on the size of the target but I always got a response. But, when slowly moving through the THS-B numbers and swinging over the target around the Null point the target would either be very quiet, just break through the threshold or not make any noise at all. So, the higher end is my preferred due to the targets I am seeking, the lower end is also fine but I will be staying away from the Null. I read that others do run at the Null point and perhaps it is their other settings that can allow for this. Or different coils, I'm not sure.

Setting the THS-B at the higher end it is quite easy to find the sweet spot. At 51 the threshold was fading in and out, 52 was OK but not quite steady enough, 53 was spot on. Heading on to 54, 55, 56 just made the threshold steadier and louder but of course that is no good on a faint target as it can't breakthrough to register a noise.

THS-A - I'm not sure if this is just a volume control because it does also help to steady up the threshold more so than just make it louder. 60 was the happy setting over the last few days.

Audio - This is not a setting, just my observations. The sound the detector makes is quite different to the Minelabs. This is neither better nor worse, just different. The Quest Wireless kit I got from PhaseTech is working a treat. And the volume control they provide has also been really handy as I haven't had to turn the THS-A right up. I can just get a nice threshold with the THS-A and then let the Quest volume do the rest.

EMI - Last Wednesday I did get about 1.5 hrs in the morning to use the QED too. EMI was horrible. Factory defaulted several times. Nothing I did made any difference. I've never really had this trouble at these locations. Saturday I factory defaulted again right from the start and it was perfect all day at the exact same spot. Sunday I left it on those settings and it was perfect again. Now I have no idea if it was something I was doing wrong on the Wednesday or it was just a bad EMI day.

Gain - This is perhaps the only setting that is making me scratch my head. I just can't get the gain above 2 or the EMI kicks in - with both the 20" and the 11". At a setting of 7 yesterday the audio just went into a constant, loud, BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR. And yet I read of others using Gain at 5, 6, 7 or whatever. It will be interesting to see what I can get up to with the Sadie being a much smaller coil and hopefully coping better with EMI.

Whilst typing I am thinking that I will also have to ensure I try raising Gain whilst holding the coil off the ground - I think I have just been resting the coil on the ground. Maybe the loud BRRRRR noise is ground mineralisation?

Hot rocks - I have not got a single hot rock as yet. I'm not sure if this is a good thing or a bad thing neutral

And that is it so far. Lots of words and possibly haven't told anyone much lol

Lots more testing to do. With real, in the ground, before they are dug targets. Air tests and planted targets give me the shats!

It's just a shame that some of these targets haven't been gold.

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#5

Jarrod84
Member
Joined: 08 October 2017
Posts: 96
Member
02 April 2019 09:59 pm

Those running higher gain might also be running Ths B in the null, and using the higher gain to pick up the signal that you were missing. I found running it just under the null point and using gain and volume to bring the signal up. If you go too far with Ths B in either direction it will give a constant loud hum, maybe this is what you are hearing?
I think also the higher the volume setting the smaller the Ths B range gets before you go too far in either direction and it will hum.

Last edited by Jarrod84 (02 April 2019 10:02 pm)

2 users like this post: Northeast, Reg Wilson

#6

Northeast
Member
Joined: 27 August 2016
Posts: 1,087
Member
02 April 2019 10:17 pm

Hi Jarrod.

I was thinking the same thing about using the Null point and then being able to increase gain. It seems there are a few different methods to reach the same result.

The constant hum thing - I had taken the THS-B and THS-A to just a steady, consistent threshold. But when Gain was upped it made that threshold ‘wavery’ to about setting 6 and then at 7 it was a completely different noise that just overtook the threshold.

I don’t think there is an issue with it, I just think that with the other settings I was using, the location I’m in and the big coil a low Gain is all that can be achieved.

I did run the Sadie today for about 2 hours and it pinged along nicely. The lead shot certainly made a return lol

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#7

Ded Driver
Member
From: West of the Border, WA
Joined: 27 May 2018
Posts: 1,206
Member
02 April 2019 11:28 pm

quiet an essay you've written up Northeast, & a good read.
I don't have a QED but am curious about them & am enjoying reading your evolving story.
keep up the good work thumbsup


APLA member, GPX4000, SD2100 Modded, ML Xterra 705 Dual Pack, GM1000, sP01 Enhancer, Garmin GPSMAP 64S, kti PLB, a map, all sorts of coils & a cupla buckets full of hope & enthusiasm

1 user likes this post: Northeast

#8

Reg Wilson
Member
Joined: 06 September 2017
Posts: 337
Member
06 April 2019 10:57 am

Well Northeast, you do seem to be getting the hang of the QED quite well, and I know that as you become more familiar with it the more you will like it. It is not really a 'switch on and go' machine, but a detector for those who can adapt to a different concept, or like Jarrod take it on as their first machine and therefore have no entrenched ideas of how to use and tune it in a manner to which they had previously been accustomed.
Getting a balance between the settings sometimes involves a compromise if EMI is strong or the ground is difficult. I have found that the newer wound coils can be noisier and perplexing in these conditions, requiring lower gain and higher mode, but little is lost in penetration by tuning down a bit. Your option is to favor a bundle wound coil in trying situations.
With more experience you will find that tuning becomes second nature as familiarity builds confidence, and your tuning will therefore take less time.
Well done on having the self confidence to master this great all Aussie detector. May it bring you the rewards you deserve.


Walmer Central Victoria
Began detecting 1979 Best colour 3Kgs Best patch 340 ozs.

1 user likes this post: Northeast

#9

Northeast
Member
Joined: 27 August 2016
Posts: 1,087
Member
06 April 2019 11:29 am

Thanks Reg.

I am perhaps making the QED sound more difficult than it really is. For basic operation it is fairly straight forward to set up.

However, the ground I am currently going over I know I am going to have to squeeze that top 10% out of the QED and doing that means learning more about the fine tuning and nuances of the QED and the coils I have currently matched it with.

The reason I need that last 10% is I know this is ground that has seen lots of GPX's and my own SDC and GPZ.

I'm not necessarily 'glad' that I have never had a GPX myself but I do think not having had one has made learning the QED much easier - no entrenched ideas as you say.

Work, kids footy and life in general are keeping me busy but I will get across at some stage to say g'day thumbsup

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#10

Northeast
Member
Joined: 27 August 2016
Posts: 1,087
Member
31 May 2019 12:42 am

Evening all.

Thought I would give an update as to how my QED adventures are going having spent a good few days in the NE and the GT of Victoria using a few different coils and also visiting the Coiltek test site at Maryborough.

I am also posting this across 3 forums that I frequent with varying amounts of input. Prospecting Australia, Detector Prospector and Australian Electronic Gold Prospecting Forum. Apart from my recent findings there have also been a few questions and comments across a few of the forums about various QEDisms and hopefully this may answer some of those queries for the people that posed them and others who may be looking at a QED with interest.

There are some people that like to fire shots across the bow of others on the forums I mentioned above. I’m not interested in that and please don’t start that in response to this post. People across all of these forums have been most helpful to me and I am posting this to try and be helpful to others, not to start arguments.

Have I found gold yet? YES!!!! One tiny, teensy little piece not far from home. That was with the 11” Detech Ultra Sensing coil.

The 5 days recently spent in the GT were hard yakka and I didn’t find any gold. But neither did Mitchel (from DP with his GPZ) and Elusive (DP and PA with his SD2200). Elusive did take home some consolation prizes with his SDC of 2 species and another small piece of gold. Apart from 1 spot we mostly covered flogged ground.

With the recent rain I was apprehensive about how the QED was going to handle the mineralisation. My personal feeling is that wet mineralised ground ‘lights up’ the mineralisation and makes ground noise issues greater. For example, my GPZ hated wet, red clay but would play nicely in the same ground when dry. The QED is not much different I find. A depression in the clay that has allowed water to sit and moisten the clay, surrounded by hard packed, dry clay would give the QED issues. The mineralisation and also the variability between the density of the ground creates problems in my opinion (for the QED and the GPZ).

The important thing though is how did the QED (and the operator) deal with with these problems. Well, this time around I dealt with it a lot better. Isn’t it funny how the more you use a detector and get used to it the easier it seems to be :-) Most of the ground noise that showed up gave a wide response and also a variable response - meaning that it wouldn’t always be in the exact same spot like a genuine target should be.
Using the GB change of 4 points up or 4 points down also confirmed things for me. 4 down would often soften the response greatly and 4 up would sharpen the response greatly. I have been very scared using this method as I really do not wish to walk away from a genuine target and due to this I dug (or at least scratched a few inches off) every target I got. Not a single time in 5 days did this technique fail and I end up popping a genuine target out of the hole.

I tried to remember to do this on targets that I was sure were targets before digging them and the response might change the very slightest amount but essentially they sounded the same. I didn’t always remember to do this though as I was excited to dig what seemed a genuine article.

Lead shot/BBs/.22 bullets/lead fragments - if digging these is a sign that a detector is working then the QED was purring because these little **&%$$##%&* absolutely pop. There is no mistaking that they are a target.

Ground Balance - the settings I used on the 11” and the ground (especially around Bendigo) meant that a spot on GB only had a variation of 1-2 points. So, the unit may be ground balanced at 110 but just out at 111 or 109. Getting a GB is now quicker with more use and recognising when it is out of GB is also becoming more innate. It is now at a point where a quick, on the fly re-GB is not an inconvenience.

THS-A, THS-B - Have now found happy settings for these with the 11” and sticking with them until such a time that I need to change.
Gain - still having issues getting a stable threshold with a setting of 2 or above and I forgot to discuss this with Reg when I was with him. I have occasionally punched the Gain up to 3 or 4 to find a really, really, tiny target as it brightens the signal but it also ratties up the threshold so it can’t be kept there.

Mode - Adjusted this better over my GT trip in response to the ground conditions and it allowed improved handling of various ground conditions. Again, learning the features of the unit and when to utilise them (and remembering to utilise them!) has helped a lot.

Goldman’s QED Tips thread on the AEGPF has been quite useful in getting an understanding of the finer points of using the QED - so thanks to Goldman.

There was a comment on DP forum that related to Jonathon Porter’s review of the QED back in 2017. It was something like the QED is ‘best suited to small targets in less mineralised ground’ and the question posed was if this is the case then why not just use a VLF? This was in 2017 and there have been several more modes added to the QED since then. The belief is that this has given the QED a greater range of ground conditions that it can effectively work and my opinion would be that the QED is quite well suited to a variety of gold sizes in a variety of grounds.
This is in no way a slight on JP’s review as I believe he simply ‘called it as he saw it’ at the time. The advances in the number of Modes available may lead JP to a different view now.

I would like to back up my statement of “the QED is quite well suited to a variety of gold sizes in a variety of grounds” by showing some wonderfully large and small nuggets but unfortunately I can’t. All can say is that I have dug some quite deep .22 bullets and other rubbish and a visit to the Coiltek test site proved quite interesting.

I gave the 20” NF Advantage Spoked coil (bundle wound) and the 11” Detech Ultra Sensing coil (spiral wound) a run here.

The 20” picked up the smallest target of 3 grams, the 2 ouncer and the 5 ouncer without any worries. I think the other 2 targets are 7 grams and 15 grams and it got the slightest hit on one of them but not enough to stop me out in the field and no hit on the other at all.

The 11” really surprised me. It got a hit on the 3 grams, 15 grams, 2 ouncer and 15 ouncer. It missed the 7 gram though which was interesting. However, the Coiltek fella that was there said many detectors had trouble with that particular target.

Mitchel’s GPZ got all targets except the 5 ouncer. We did try a few different settings but couldn’t get a peep on it. I have seen other’s on PA say they have got all targets there with their GPZ’s and I can’t help but think there was something in Mitchel’s settings that was limiting it. As a previous GPZ owner (who loved it!) I have seen it pull some ridiculously deep stuff and find it odd that it couldn’t pick that piece up.

The Coiltek fella had an SDC and it couldn’t get anything which only surprised me on the first target - I thought it might/should have got it.

A few things to point out.

I keep comparing the QED to my GPZ and although that is not a fair comparison I have not used anything else that does compare.

I respect Howard for the progress he is making with the QED and the fact that it is an Australian product makes me a proud purchaser. However, please don’t feel I am making comments on the QED as a means of persuading anyone to make a purchase. Having layman’s reviews of any product may help those in the market decide if a particular item is going to work for them. I probably align myself with a comment from Ararat Gold recently that he is not brand loyal. I will buy what works for me at the price point I can afford regardless of brand. (If that product happens to be Australian then all the better ;-)

Previously I have felt that I am reasonably happy with my QED purchase. The 5 days in the GT has increased that feeling of content and I am quite confident in approaching different areas/tasks with the QED in hand and getting the job done. The variety of coils available is a new joy and headache for me and the new ‘X coils’ might be a really interesting development for the QED.

As always though, it doesn’t matter what you swing you have to get your coil over some yellow first.

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#11

Reg Wilson
Member
Joined: 06 September 2017
Posts: 337
Member
31 May 2019 02:17 pm

Great report Adam. Like you, I am very interested in what the X coils will do for a QED, and will no doubt purchase one when they are in full production.


Walmer Central Victoria
Began detecting 1979 Best colour 3Kgs Best patch 340 ozs.

1 user likes this post: Northeast

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