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#1

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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10 May 2018 09:24 pm

I have experimented with this stuff for some years now, and I back it 100%.
But with modifications.
Firstly I use the 20mm cat walk mesh as opposed to the 12mm.
Scalloping the high side of the webs really helps a good turbulence in the baffle principal, takes a bit of time to do but very needed.
a much larger air gap between the base of your banker and the bottom edge of your mesh is totally the go, But! You must run an under flow restrictor 3/4 the way up the top, reducing it back to approximately 3-4mm.
I use a piece of angle inverted.
Believe it or not... my air gap is almost 18mm! Not including the restrictor.
If you run this stuff first, you will be cutting down your banker in length in no time!
Honestly ignore all the slanted mesh, moss, this and that. And run 300mm of this stuff... without matting! And you will be surprised at how simple and easy this stuff works.
The cook and I went halves in some dream vortex mat.
I do like it ! I've 18 inches of it after the mesh... not a fly poop of gold in it.
but im sure as the mat will run perfectly in a river sluice alone.
It is nice to have the mat as a back up principal following the mesh.
So easy to clean up with little cons.
im more than happy to keep using it.
dont under estimate buying the 6" stuff. It dose seem to like a good flow of water, this I believe is a better way than too add more decline.
What you are trying to create is a whirlpool, this can be undoone by too much angle. ( my interpretation anyhow)
Your want the water flow and turbulence to make it work more so than just a fast drop.
who cares if you think you have too much black in your cells! It's obviously working and any gold will beat that stuff too the bottom anyhow.
I think if your lower point of the "J" isn't self cleaning within reason. Then add more water before dropping any angle ratio.
Dont expect to just see gold in the cells! If your seeing a lot of black... your on the right track. thumbsup

Last edited by mudgee hunter (10 May 2018 09:59 pm)

1 user likes this post: RM Outback

#2

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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10 May 2018 09:38 pm

1525948672_20180427_154358.jpg

8 users like this post: 7.62marksman, Mackka, Rusty_G, RM Outback, Goldfreak, roddosnow, Stru, Bluecurrant

#3

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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10 May 2018 09:47 pm

As you can see, a next to nothing angle is needed. 5-10 negative degrees is standard.
With this combination of traps, being that the mat seems to prefer high volume of water, I could near run flat.
Dont get caught up in rocket science of plain simple principles I say!
Im more than happy to challenge a banker vs banker,shovel for shovel, as I would love to run a better principal, simpler unit if there is one.

Last edited by mudgee hunter (10 May 2018 09:51 pm)

2 users like this post: Rusty_G, RM Outback

#4

AussieChris
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From: Bathurst, NSW
Joined: 08 April 2015
Posts: 573
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10 May 2018 10:58 pm

Mate, you sure are a Mad Scientist, you will have to let me in on where you are finding all this mesh etc, I'm still after some punch plate!
Hopefully, we can catch up soon when the river is not frozen over! My missus seen a post on Facebook tonight showing snowfalls down Oberon way so yep its here.
I kinda had it in my head to go to Sunny Corner this weekend and play in the mud but who knows.


"About 10 minutes into it everything changed, buckets were flying ... people were bleeding. Girls were unconscious."

1 user likes this post: mudgee hunter

#5

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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10 May 2018 11:02 pm

Still have some SS 8MM high percentage punched sheet. Cant post. Can organize the mesh through a friend up the coast.

#6

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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11 May 2018 09:49 am

Oops, meant can post sorry. Pm you. The 20mm catwalk mesh is available in west Gosford. Average peice would be $25. Good value.
I'll post a pic of the mesh showing the the scolloping, restrictor etc shortly.
A 5" grinder is preferred, you can use a four inch.
The banker above is one I built for a friend. He wanted it this length.
If I was to build another unit, I would actually make the hopper another 150mm longer if anything.
But this unit above being longer than my other two bankers I've made dose make it more stable.
The remaining 18"s of dream mat, I cut down too 2x 6" mats at 18", then simply used cheap super glue and joined them to make a 36" river sluice.
It can be cut with a good long blade.
And the glue seems to be a good strong join.
I did find that the mat dose not mind being compressed on the walls a little. So 3mm shy of the width of the mat width is fine, and makes a snug water tight fit, thus it will help eliminate sand getting underneath it and lifting the mat during use.

1 user likes this post: roddosnow

#7

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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11 May 2018 12:33 pm

1526002344_20180511_105419.jpg

The webs highlighted in blue are where you scallop the webs. The top of the foto is the high end of the trap

2 users like this post: AussieChris, Bluecurrant

#8

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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11 May 2018 12:34 pm

1526002457_20180511_105430.jpg

This foto shows the scolloping depth.

Approximately 70mm wide

13mm in depth

 Mark the centre of the web to be scolloped, then mark 35mm each side, then mark the same row at the top in the same way.

Use a ruler an align these marks to all the other webs that need doing. 

Put a vertical mark down so as you dont loose your grinding width when gringing it.

Then repeat each row. 

1 user likes this post: AussieChris

#9

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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11 May 2018 12:36 pm

1526002556_20180511_105444.jpg

Part A is the rear restrictor, 32x3mm alloy flat bar, flush with the top of the mesh. 2nd A is 8x12mm angle. Custom cut from 12x12mm.

Part B is a 6mm SS counter sunk bolt, a nut either side for adjustable foot seating.

Part C has an air gap of 12mm from bottom of mesh, ending up at 15mm when the 3mm gaskit seal is in place.

Part D, is the clamp end modified to clamp the dream mat. Notice lip on the end.

3 users like this post: roddosnow, AussieChris, Bluecurrant

#10

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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11 May 2018 12:38 pm

1526002666_20180511_105513.jpg

Part E, is the same part as part A, but showing rear fixing through the top web

1 user likes this post: Bluecurrant

#11

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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11 May 2018 12:43 pm

1526002931_20180511_105604.jpg
1526002994_20180511_105624.jpg

Showing the SS bolt as a foot rest. 

1 user likes this post: Bluecurrant

#12

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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11 May 2018 12:45 pm

1526003085_20180511_105654.jpg

Part D, clamp for it and the mat in all in one.

1 user likes this post: Bluecurrant

#13

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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11 May 2018 12:49 pm

1526003334_20180511_114540.jpg

underside veiw

1 user likes this post: Bluecurrant

#14

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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11 May 2018 01:04 pm

The outer C channel was cut down from 25mm SHS (box) .
This helps stiffen the mesh keeping it straight, and aids in fitment. Only needs to be 10mm wide.
The mesh fitted in a teared hopper must be at least 60mm from the back wall, lower than the drop zone.
I use a 10mm SS eyebolt with a nyloc nut to set depth, and a wing nut on the under side to clamp with, sandwiched with a 3mm rubber gaskit.
a peice of 40x5 or 3mm flat bar attached underneath is very advisable for stiffening the clamp zone.
and put your pan under the hole when stripping down.
I always know how well I went on that dig just by looking at the gold that falls in to the pan through that small hole. Like a sneak peak! Ha

2 users like this post: roddosnow, Bluecurrant

#15

RM Outback
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Joined: 10 March 2016
Posts: 2,722
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11 May 2018 02:05 pm

thumbsup great build and idea's, love the scalloping idea thanks for sharing. Would it be better to have your height adjustment screws come from the top for fine tuning once set up.

2 users like this post: roddosnow, mudgee hunter

#16

AussieChris
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From: Bathurst, NSW
Joined: 08 April 2015
Posts: 573
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11 May 2018 02:36 pm

Love your work Dr. Frankenstein thumbsup

I thought I had it bad, my case is mild compared to yours!

Do you even sleep?

Nah all jokes aside it seems like you have put a lot of thought into this, thanks for sharing. Looks very effective.


"About 10 minutes into it everything changed, buckets were flying ... people were bleeding. Girls were unconscious."

1 user likes this post: mudgee hunter

#17

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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11 May 2018 02:54 pm

Yes RM. mine is 27mm from the top of C channel to bottom of bolt. This keeps an air gap of 3-4mm of the underflow restrictors.
I used 5" big grit flap dics, with the web facing downwards. Stood up right in a vice, Align each edge of the mark to flap disc, and push straight downwards. Use a good Stanley to keep triming the thick burr off.
With the 5", the scollop radius is the same as a new flap disc.
NOTE. The mesh has a small lip on the tread side. This must be ground off to give you flat flush surface at the top and bottom edges of the webb, or it will kick the angle incorrectly. Only needs grinding at contact points. One minute job.

Last edited by mudgee hunter (11 May 2018 03:00 pm)

#18

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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11 May 2018 03:13 pm

1526011818_20180511_140315.jpg

just the part in blue where it makes contact with at the bottom and at the top. Mine had 3 at bottom and 3 at the top to made flush

Last edited by mudgee hunter (11 May 2018 03:14 pm)

1 user likes this post: Bluecurrant

#19

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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11 May 2018 03:32 pm

1526012654_20180511_141634.jpg

mark the web like so, keeping the disc edges on the point will give you the right depth when using a 5" at a 70mm width on the 20mm cat walk mesh.
Tip. Mark all the webs to be scolloped first with a marker along the top as well, so you dont grind the wrong ones.

2 users like this post: RM Outback, Bluecurrant

#20

iamagoldenoldie2
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From: south west Sydney
Joined: 07 August 2016
Posts: 373
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17 May 2018 02:50 am

walked into a scrap metal yard near me the other day, and there they were 2 offcuts of the golden catwalk mesh one was the 12 mm and the other was the 22mm thick mesh, asked at the office, how much will the catwalk mesh set me back, oohhh its been set aside there for a customer not sure if there is any more would the screen door mesh interest you , no , just my luck the catwalk mesh is an Ulrich profile they sell 12mm and 22mm deep oh well just keep on looking if I find some is there anyone interested in some I'm located in campbelltown nsw

1 user likes this post: mudgee hunter

#21

Marked
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Joined: 29 August 2013
Posts: 338
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17 May 2018 11:12 pm

Trying not to sound too negative - I am certain what you have done works a treat -

It looks to me what you have done with the scalloping is duplicate the action of the sloped mesh that Wal specifies for his "non-gem" build of banker, and potentially reduce the effectiveness of the catwalk for those people chasing the gems.

In your little sluice at the start of topic, I would be a little worried at the seeming lack of length in the skid plate leading up to the mesh; I guess if your "flow reducer" is close to hard against the bottom, it will be negating any stratification of the heavier materials anyway.

Personally, I would ditch the mat, move your mesh (or use ready made sloped) in place of, and have a nice long skid plate for the heavies to drop to the bottom before reaching the mesh.

I have run a home-made walbanker for over three years and agree whole-heartedly with the mesh on bare bottom principle. Having checked carefully on many occasions now, have only ever seen a fly-speck or two make it past the mesh in a dialed-in banker.

Cheers for effort but.


"The Sun's not Yellow, It's Chicken." Bob Dylan - Tombstone Blues (Highway 61 Revisited{1965})

#22

iamagoldenoldie2
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From: south west Sydney
Joined: 07 August 2016
Posts: 373
Member
18 May 2018 01:11 am

after reading all the posts on the type of mesh and the purpose of such is that it liquefies the material fed into the sluice so the heavies drop out and the lighter stuff gets washed away thus the taper in the design to influence velocity if it works then it works mudgee's highbanker is a shortie and he's of the opinion that ir works well, same as wal's design its a little longer the crucial element is the catwalk mesh think i found some but they want $25 a metre 600 mm wide so I could get 6 bits out of a metre length ,300 mm long and 300 mm wide

1 user likes this post: mudgee hunter

#23

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
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19 May 2018 07:51 pm

I will stipulate now, that I do not chase gems. And this modification has zero to do with such. Strictly gold catchment in the first 400mm.
And running this modificationsis using a teared high banker with 20mm high cat walk mesh. Not the 12mm stuff.
Wals design needs a 400m skid plate before hand as the material from the cable falls vertically from above. Thus adding an extra 400mm of unesseary length to the banker.
the slanted mesh is a totally different material, and is NOT comparative in any means.
I would run this banker alone at 400mm with just the one trapping method as described, but stability comes into play.
I would rather a longer hopper if anything!
You will see caking of mud and silt in wals videos if you take a proper look at him stripping his unit... this is NOT what you want.
As I said previously... shovel for shovel will prove the point. Some will never understand the physics of it and the simplicity....
to those I do not apologize to, yet feel sorry for their ignorance.
Run a 1200mm+ banker and stick to not understanding.

#24

mudgee hunter
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Joined: 02 January 2017
Posts: 802
Member
20 May 2018 11:19 am

I have previously posted about the topic of the Wal flat banker Vs a teared hopper design,  for those who where making the choice between the two designs.  And with reading it, obviously I choose the variable teared design out right.
https://www.prospectingaustralia.com.au … p?id=21885

* compact size ( speaks for itself! )

The banker shown that "Marker" has described as being "little" is actually 1400mm long, if the hopper length is actually factored in as it should be. And can sit on the rear seat with easy room for a decent esky! 

* once you shovel your material into the hopper, 95% self cleaning with no need to put your shovel down and go stand next to it and rake it all out. Big down time lost to do this process.

*aprox 400mm of extra length is added and needed in the Wal banker, as the material from the hopper falls directly from the cable tray above. Thus it needs this skid plate. This is simply NOT needed with a teared hopper and the mesh fitted like explained. 

*water flow dynamics are totally different between these two units. 

At running the same amount of water volume into each of these of these two units...

The Wal banker gets its water speed mostly from the negative angle it has been set up at. 

A teared hopper arrangement catches all the water above in the hopper, then it descends at a faster ratio than the base is "dialed in at" ,

And drops it in a smaller concentrated area at the rear of the base. So it has a faster approach to mesh, eliminating the skid (400m+).

If you are having trouble understanding this... imagine settting a Wal banker up DEAD FLAT! 

Would it work running at the same water volume per minute as what it would at the correct "dialled in" angle? 

NO! .... Why?  The water is dispersed over a large area, falling vertically through the cable tray (like shower) onto the"skid plate" area with the bulk of the material. Once full, it would overflow at the same rate as the volume in. And at best taking light material like silt and sand with it. And caking or compaction would happen within the first shovel load. 

With the higher pitch fall gained by the angle of the hopper, being directed as one concentrated wave starting at the rear with the material already in the water with velocity,  has a much more efficient run up at the mesh. 

Thus I can run this unit DEAD FLAT! 

*if one was to swear by mesh, with only ever getting a fly poo speck after it... why have the moss and bread create? 

Uneeded extra length then. 

I would be getting the grinder out and cutting it down! 

Last edited by mudgee hunter (20 May 2018 11:27 am)

#25

Keitzy
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Joined: 20 December 2017
Posts: 160
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20 May 2018 02:15 pm

have you got a pic of the inside of your hopper ?


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