Hypatia Stone

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Chiron52

Dave
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I found this article quite interesting -
"A stone from space found in Egypt in 2013 continues to baffle scientists after a detailed analysis of its components revealed it was unlike any other extraterrestrial rock ever found.
The Hypatia Stone named after a third century Egyptian female mathematician was found a few years ago. In 2013, researchers announced that it was not from earth, and by 2015 other teams using noble gas analysis and nuclear probes confirmed that it was not part of a meteorite or comet.
This, of course, left the question of its origin still begging. Now research from a team at South Africas University of South Africa has produced a thorough analysis of the pebbles component parts and the mystery, far from being resolved, has only deepened.
Its now official: the Hypatia Stone is deeply weird.
To conduct their analysis, the team, led by Jan Kramers, first separated the stones intrinsic components from the terrestrial bits and bobs that had accumulated in and around it.
Looking at the former, the first thing Kramer and his colleagues confirmed was that it was nothing at all like the make-up of most meteorites. Like the Earth itself, meteorites typically contain a small amount of carbon and a large amount of silicon.
Hypatia, in contrast, has a massive amount of carbon and an unusually small amount of silicon, says Kramer.
Thats odd, but by no means the oddest thing the researchers found.
"Even more unusual, the matrix contains a high amount of very specific carbon compounds, called polyaromatic hydrocarbons, or PAH, a major component of interstellar dust, which existed even before our solar system was formed, says Kramer.
Interstellar dust is also found in comets and meteorites that have not been heated up for a prolonged period in their history.
This suggests that the stone is immensely old. Just how old, remains to be determined, but other discoveries made by Kramers team are generating immense excitement.
Most of the PAH compounds have transformed into tiny diamonds the result, the researchers suggest, of the force of impact when the much larger rock of which Hypatia is a surviving fragment smacked into the Earth.
Other elements, however, protected inside the rock, have remained unchanged, and are confounding expectations.
Hypatia contains aluminium in a pure micro-nugget form something never before seen on earth or in space rocks.
We also found silver iodine phosphide and silicon carbide grains, again in highly unexpected forms, says co-author Georgy Belyanin.
The grains are the first documented to be found in situ without having to first dissolve the surrounding rock with acid. There are also grains of a compound consisting of mainly nickel and phosphorus, with very little iron; a mineral composition never observed before on Earth or in meteorites.
The scientists suggest that these components along with some strange nickel-phosphorus-iron grains mean that significant parts of the Hypatia Stone were formed in pre-solar times that is, before the sun, let alone the planets, had formed.
Clearly, the mysteries of Hypatia are still to be fully resolved."
SOURCE: https://cosmosmagazine.com/earth/earth-sciences/weird-et-stone-gets-even-weirder/

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A very interesting 'Rock' that's for sure.... Read an article on this rock last week...Pre Solar times.. Now that is very strange...

Would love a piece for the Cabinet tho.. :rolleyes:

LW....
 
Would this be hypatia? I have one
Given the rarity, & complex nature of it's make-up, I don't think even guessing on this one would be any good.
A detailed analysis is likely the only real way to get a definitive answer.


Using sophisticated electron microscopy to determine the compositions of microscopic parts of the Hypatia stone, Kramers and fellow geologists at the University of Johannesburg identified the parts of the rock that were not added when it impacted Earth. They found that many compounds in the stone seem to have formed prior to the sun and planets. The elements are the same—carbon and silicon and aluminum and iron—but the ratios of these elements in the material are all wrong, unlike the compositions of objects that orbit the sun. https://www.popularmechanics.com/sc...ains-compounds-not-found-in-the-solar-system/
 
There are some seriously weird things floating around in space and even in interstellar space. The reason the Earth has so many different elements in it is that it is the result of many generations of stars that blew up (supernovas) or in the case of smaller stars just puffed out their carbon rich gas outer layers. These processes formed the metal rich dust clouds that eventually coalesced into the sun and the rocky and other planets of our solar system.
In the early universe dust clouds were relatively heavy element poor and consisted of elements up to iron which is the end atomic fusion product of a normal stars evolution. It is only when these clouds are seeded with the heavier metals gold, lead, uranium etc, formed by supernova explosions of massive stars, that metal rich solar systems such as ours can form. Lucky us prospectors.
This process of heavy element “seeding“ takes billions of years involving successions of supernovae and the mixing of their dust with the dust from other stars that just puffed off carbon rich outer layers of gas.
It seems significant that the Hypatia stone seems light element rich and heavy element poor or at least there is little mention of the latter. That would suggest that the dust cloud from which it formed was very much older than that from which the sun and its solar system formed. Probably much older or at least in a region of our galaxy which had few stars to begin with.
It is not unusual for significant masses to be found wandering around interstellar space and there may be even as many planets, asteroids, comets, meteoric lumps of various sizes and shapes in interstellar space as are found orbiting around stars. With the Herschel space telescope and the VLT here on Earth, astronomers have now detected some of the planet size objects in interstellar space and dubbed them "rogue" planets, being planets that formed around a sun but were ejected by gravitational interaction with other bodies in that forming solar system.
These objects can later be recaptured by any solar system they encounter in their billions of years of interstellar wandering.
I suspect that the Hypatia stone may well be part of one of those smaller (and probably numerous) ancient wandering objects captured by our solar system during its formation or later in its 4 billion year history, and which later fell to Earth.
 
There are some seriously weird things floating around in space and even in interstellar space. The reason the Earth has so many different elements in it is that it is the result of many generations of stars that blew up (supernovas) or in the case of smaller stars just puffed out their carbon rich gas outer layers. These processes formed the metal rich dust clouds that eventually coalesced into the sun and the rocky and other planets of our solar system.
In the early universe dust clouds were relatively heavy element poor and consisted of elements up to iron which is the end atomic fusion product of a normal stars evolution. It is only when these clouds are seeded with the heavier metals gold, lead, uranium etc, formed by supernova explosions of massive stars, that metal rich solar systems such as ours can form. Lucky us prospectors.
This process of heavy element “seeding“ takes billions of years involving successions of supernovae and the mixing of their dust with the dust from other stars that just puffed off carbon rich outer layers of gas.
It seems significant that the Hypatia stone seems light element rich and heavy element poor or at least there is little mention of the latter. That would suggest that the dust cloud from which it formed was very much older than that from which the sun and its solar system formed. Probably much older or at least in a region of our galaxy which had few stars to begin with.
It is not unusual for significant masses to be found wandering around interstellar space and there may be even as many planets, asteroids, comets, meteoric lumps of various sizes and shapes in interstellar space as are found orbiting around stars. With the Herschel space telescope and the VLT here on Earth, astronomers have now detected some of the planet size objects in interstellar space and dubbed them "rogue" planets, being planets that formed around a sun but were ejected by gravitational interaction with other bodies in that forming solar system.
These objects can later be recaptured by any solar system they encounter in their billions of years of interstellar wandering.
I suspect that the Hypatia stone may well be part of one of those smaller (and probably numerous) ancient wandering objects captured by our solar system during its formation or later in its 4 billion year history, and which later fell to Earth.


Very informative and a nice read. Reminded me a bit of last night...


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Whatever you do, If you think you have a 'space' rock, NEVER use a magnet on it... If you do, you will 'kill' the space element of the rock and it can be very hard to identify correctly.... All the time I see on a Philippines rock page that they have heaps over there and thats the very first thing they do , Stick a Magnet on it... Then they offer it up for sale..... Pass thank-you...

LW....
 
Some info for you....
Why shouldn't you put a magnet on a meteorite?

The commonly used method for identifying space rocks can destroy scientific information. Touching even a small magnet to a meteorite can erase any record the rock might have retained about the magnetic field of its parent body, researchers report in the April Journal of Geophysical Research: Planets.9 May 2023...

https://www.sciencenews.org/article...for,Journal of Geophysical Research: Planets.
LW...
 
If a substance has magnetism it is said to be a magnet.
Meteorites are no different to other things containing magnetic materials like some rocks and metals and can have residual magnetism imprinted by various means such as cooling and solidifying under the effect of the Earths magnetic field or by touching or rubbing with a permanent magnet. So depending on many natural processes meteorites may or may not have magnetism.
Meteorites are not, however, defined by having magnetism.
The main definition of a meteorite (apart from its appearance or form) is the elemental composition of its material. In the context of this discussion that means its magnetic material, usually an alloy of iron, nickel and cobalt.
There is a difference between magnetism and magnetic material. If a specimen has magnetism it will be attracted to one pole of a permanent magnet and repelled by the other. If the specimen is described as being simply magnetic material, it will be attracted equally to both poles.
So touching a permanent magnet to a meteorite, whilst in theory could change its residual magnetism, that is of no consequence as that does not change anything about the properties (mainly appearance and elemental composition) that define a meteorite.
Lonewolf, I had written this before you referenced the research about Martian meteorites and can see how it would compromise their research value. Good luck to them in that regard as it may give an additional means of identifying WHERE some meteorites originate from not only Mars.
I've gone ahead and posted anyway as I feel still that as far as changing something as basic as to what defines a meteorite, I don't think a touch by a magnet would change that.
In a way, it comes back to the question whether all meteorites belong to the scientific research community or whether there is a place for private collection and ownership of them.
 
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Hence why some say yes do it and some say no don't... Lots of different theories out there.... Me, I have never found one but would love to... And most likely if i did, Id have it in my Collection as a Possible Space rock and thats it... Mums the word as Men in Black might come knocking...😂🤣....

On another note, Its getting very interesting with all the 'rovers' landing on the Moon and other localities... The next few years will tell us a lot more about the Unknown.... Hope Im still here to read about all this new stuff....

LW...
 
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